| 00:00:07 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
WHO WAS ASSASSINATED BY POLITICAL OPPONENTS. THE ASIA SOCIETY OF NEW YORK CITY HOSTS THIS HOUR 20 MINUTES TALK. BACK AT HOME AT 72 LEFT IN THE DAY...
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| 00:07:51 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
THAT HELPS. >> WELCOME AT ANY RATE. IT'S MY PRIVILEGE TO DO
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| 00:07:57 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
THIS. I COME WITH ADMIRATION FOR A LOT OF THE CHOICES
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| 00:08:00 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
YOU HAVE MADE IN YOUR STILL YOUNG PROFESSIONAL LIFE TO APPROACH THIS BOOK AS A JOURNALIST AND OTHER JOURNALISM THAT YOU HAVE DONE. AND I SUSPECT WITHOUT...
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| 00:08:47 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
EARLY IN HIS LIFE. AND HE WAS A TEENAGER WHEN HE WAS TOLD HE WOULD BE MARRIED A WOMAN TEN YEARS OLDER THAN HIM. HE DIDN'T LIKE THE SOUND OF THAT SO...
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| 00:09:57 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
HAD COME OVER DURING PARTITION
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| 00:09:59 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AND SHE WAS FROM A SHIA FAMILY SO THEY DIDN'T QUITE LIKE THE SOUND OF THAT. SO THEY EVOKED AND MARRIED AND THEIR FIRST CHILD WAS BORN SOON AFTER,...
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| 00:11:10 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
SO THAT WE CAN TURN TO THE NARRATIVE IN YOUR BOOK HOMAGES TO CREATE A LITTLE CONTEXT FOR IT. BUT BEFORE WE TALK ABOUT YOUR FATHER'S MURDER IN HIS LIFE...
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| 00:11:41 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
RECONSTRUCTED IT, WHAT IS UNIFORM ABOUT THE NATURE OF THE WORLD THAT YOUR FATHER GREW UP AND AND HOW IT INFLUENCED HER FATHER'S EXECUTION. >> WELL,...
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| 00:11:59 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AFTER A VERY BLOODY PARTITION. AND IT WAS A TIME WHEN GOVERNMENT OF GREAT POSSIBILITY. AND THE COUNTRY'S FIRST CONSTITUTION WAS WRITTEN IN 1973. THE...
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| 00:13:47 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
MOST INCLUSIVE POSSIBLE, WHAT YOU JUST PROVIDED WAS THE ACCOUNT OF YOUR FATHER'S MURDER IN 19 -- >> 1996. IN HIS 14 YEARS ALMOST TO THE WEEK. HE WAS...
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| 00:14:06 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
FORWARD TO 1979. YOUR GRANDFATHER IS EXECUTED, YOUR FATHER
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| 00:14:11 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
IS GROWING UP IN THE PROGRESSIVE PAKISTANI DESCRIBED. HE'S INFLUENCED BY SORT OF THE SECULAR LEFT AND ALSO A LITTLE BIT BY THE INTERNATIONAL REVOLUTIONARY...
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| 00:15:38 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
MAKES THE CHOICE TO CONFRONT THE REGIME DIRECTLY AND
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| 00:15:42 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
MILITARILY, THEY WERE 25 AND 21 YEARS OLD. THEY HAD THOUGHT FOR TWO YEARS THEY HAVE SACRIFICED THEIR OWN LIFE. SEAN WAS ABANDONED A STUDY OF MY FATHER...
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| 00:16:31 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
IT CHANGES THEIR LIVES. >> IN THAT THEY HAVE
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| 00:16:36 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
REALISTIC PREPARATION? >> CLEARLY NOT COMING IN NOW, IT WAS A CHOICE THAT THEY MADE RATIONALLY OR
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| 00:16:45 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
PASSIONATELY. BUT IT WAS A CHOICE MUCH LARGER THAN NOT. THEY ARE IN AFGHANISTAN AT A TIME WHEN YOU PROBABLY OUGHT NOT TO BE IN AFGHANISTAN. THEY ARE...
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| 00:17:59 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
DAUGHTERS JOURNEY TO TRY TO FIGURE OUT WHAT WAS PROVED IN THE MIDST OF ALL OF THIS MEANT UNPOLITICAL ACCUSATION AND CONFUSION. AND OF COURSE MANY ALLEGATIONS...
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| 00:18:28 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AND TERRORISM WERE PLACED AGAINST THEM BY THE REGIME. THE MOST FAMOUS THAT WAS THE HIJACKING WAS API PLANE. BY THE TIME THEY WERE ACCUSED OF THE HIJACKING,...
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| 00:19:48 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
PERIOD OF EXILE IN DAMASCUS, WITH SOME INTERMITTENT TRAVEL TO SAFE COUNTRIES I PRESUME FOR YOUR FATHER AND FOR YOURSELF, BUT NOT BACK TO PAKISTAN FOR...
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| 00:20:13 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
BROWN MOVIE. BUT IT WASN'T. WE LIVED IN A TWO-BEDROOM FLAT. MY FATHER WAS A TERRIBLE COOK AND WAS UNDER THE REPRESSION THAT U.S.A. WONDERFUL CODE...
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| 00:21:24 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
RESTORATION OF DEMOCRACY THROUGH PAKISTAN PEOPLE'S PARTY. AND HER FATHER REMAINS IN SERIOUS AND IS NOT WELCOME HOME. BUT WHAT WERE YOUR IMPRESSIONS...
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| 00:21:58 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
KILLED. AND IT'S ON THE HEEL OF THE SHAUNA WAS THIS MURDER THAT BENAZIR AND TO ENTER INTO POWER-SHARING NEGOTIATIONS COME WITH THE SAME MACHINERY...
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| 00:23:23 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
THE BOOK THAT HE BELIEVES SHE SHOULD SIT IN THE
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| 00:23:27 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
OPPOSITION. AND SHE DIDN'T. SHE FELT IT WAS VERY MUCH TIME TO ROLL. AND THE TENSION REALLY STARTS FROM THERE. >> IT DOES PREVIOUSLY BEEN CORDIAL ENOUGH....
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| 00:23:44 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
SIBLINGS WOULD BE 18 MONTHS BETWEEN THEM. THEY WERE ALWAYS VERY
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| 00:23:47 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
CLOSE. AND VERY FOND OF EACH OTHER. THAT CHANGED IN A LOT OF THE FAMILY CHANGED WHEN POWER CAME BACK INTO THE EQUATION. >> SO YOU MENTIONED A SHAUNA...
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| 00:24:04 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
YEARS. ONE NIGHT EXCEPT ABOUT THE FIRST THING I DID WAS TURN TO THE INDEX AND SEE WHAT YOU DISCOVERED. AND SO FOR THE SAKE OF TIME I WILL NOT SPEND...
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| 00:25:07 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
YOUNG FATHER. LIFE IN AFGHANISTAN HAS NOT GONE THE WAY THEY IMAGINED IT WOULD. AND THEY LEAVE AND GO TO FRANCE BECAUSE THEY WANT A CHANCE AT A NORMAL...
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| 00:26:05 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
OR ARRESTED BY THE ARMY. THIS IS SOMETHING THAT HAS BEEN PROVIDED TO THEM, THEY DEPORTED HIM TO TAKE THEIR GUYS VERY QUICKLY IF THEY MIXED IT WITH ANOTHER...
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| 00:26:46 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
ANY GOOD FAITH TALK TO POLICE CONFESSION ON IT ON. AT THE TIME OF THE MURDERS THERE WERE THREE SERIES. THE FIRST WAS SUICIDE, WHICH THE FAMILY NEVER...
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| 00:28:42 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
OR MURDERERS. I ASSUME YOU MEAN YOUR GRANDFATHER, AND YOUR FATHER, BENAZIR. >> I SHOULD SAY THE FAMILY WAS TOLD THAT HE WAS HANGED. BUT THEY NEVER...
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| 00:28:58 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
THE FAMILY HEARD THE NEWS. SO HOW HE WAS KILLED IS STILL AN ISSUE OF GREAT DEBATE. >> SO LET'S BEEN FORWARD TO WHERE YOU WERE, WHETHER HE'S UP TO THE...
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| 00:29:12 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
HAD GONE DOWN WHILE YOU WERE WATCHING LOST IN SPACE WITH YOUR BROTHER AND SPEAKING TO ZARDARI ON THE TELEPHONE. AND YOU KNOW OBVIOUSLY CHARGES WERE...
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| 00:30:08 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
SHE REMAINED IN POWER, HER GOVERNMENT PASSED THE LEGISLATION. WE DID NOT SAY NO MEANINGFUL LEGISLATION, JUST ACTUALLY NO LEGISLATION. YOU THEN HAVE NO...
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| 00:30:49 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AIRPORT. HE IS ARRESTED AT THE AIRPORT ON ALL THE CHARGES FROM THE DIFFERENT PERIODS AND TAKEN TO JAIL. AND AGAIN, THESE ARE ALL CHARGES AT ALL. THE...
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| 00:35:07 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
COMING OF AGE. IF I UNDERSTAND IT CORRECTLY, CONCLUDED THAT YOUR AUNT'S HUSBAND AT LEAST IT'S NOT YOUR AUNT HAD BEEN RESPONSIBLE FOR MAKING THE DECISION...
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| 00:35:34 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
CUSTODY. IMMEDIATELY AFTER THE MURDER, WE WERE STOPPED FROM FILING A POLICE CASE, NSI ARE, WHICH IS A FIRST INFORMATION REPORT, WHICH IS EVERYBODY'S...
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| 00:37:35 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
I DID. I HAD MANY CONVERSATIONS WITH MY AUNTS ABOUT THE CASE. AND SHE DID NOT LIKE TO
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| 00:37:43 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
BE QUESTIONED. SHE DID NOT LIKE TO BE QUESTIONED JUST GENERALLY. AND ONE OF THE LAST CONVERSATIONS -- OR ONE OF THE FIRST ACTUALLY WAS I ASKED HER...
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| 00:38:45 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
LIFE. AND I WANT TO STAY A LITTLE BIT LONGER JUST TO ASK ABOUT YOURSELF. YOU CAME AS THE INTRODUCTION MENTIONED TO THE UNITED STATES FOR YOUR UNDERGRADUATE...
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| 00:39:42 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
PLACE. THE IDEA THAT SIX LETTERS OF THE LAST NINE SOMEHOW QUALIFY ANYONE FOR LEADERSHIP IS DANGEROUS AND IT HAS SERVED PAKISTAN DANGEROUSLY OR RATHER...
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| 00:41:04 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
INTERPRET. YOU'RE NOW LIVING IN KARACHI, A CITY THAT YOU'VE KNOWN I WOULD IMAGINE FOR A GOOD WHILE NOW AT LEAST AS A YOUNG WOMAN. HOW HAS KARACHI...
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| 00:41:35 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AGAINST ODDS DRIVES. IT SHOULDN'T DRIVE. IT SHOULDN'T LIVE, IT SHOULDN'T SURVIVE, BUT IT DOES. AND THERE ARE MOMENTS WHEN KARACHI IS LIKE ANY OTHER...
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| 00:42:37 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AT NIGHT, IT'S POLITICAL, ITS TURF AND ITS BEARING ITS UGLIER HIDE AGAIN. AND YOU
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| 00:42:45 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
KNOW, BEFORE 2005 OR EVEN, YOU KNOW, IT WAS EMBASSIES THAT WERE TARGETS OF VIOLENCE RATHER THAN PEOPLE. IT WAS THE TAMILS. BUT THE CITY ADAPTS ITSELF...
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| 00:43:30 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
DIE ZARDARI IS PERCEIVED BY MOST OF PAKISTAN AS SORT OF TO BE FAILING, NOT JUST BY THOSE WHO HAVE THE HISTORY THAT YOU HAVE. YOU WERE QUITE GENTLE...
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| 00:44:31 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
IS A PAKISTAN THAT IS OPENED UP ITS GUIDES AND PORTERS TO UNMANNED PREDATOR DRONES, YOU KNOW, OVER A THOUSAND OR JUST ABOUT A THOUSAND PAKISTANIS HAVE...
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| 00:47:41 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
LIKE DEMOCRATIC ELECTIONS OCCUR, THE STABILITY OF LEADERSHIP THAT TAKEOFF IS FAILED THE MANDATE THAT BROUGHT THEM THERE AND OFTEN THEY FAIL IN SPACE...
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| 00:48:35 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
POLITICS. A FIFTH ZARDARI -- WE DON'T EVEN CALL THEM ELECTIONS, WE CALLED THEM ELECTIONS. AND THE SAME SELECTIONS BUT ROD GENERAL MUSHARRAF OFF THE...
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| 00:51:26 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
CONSTITUTIONAL PAKISTAN BY CONTINUALLY RESURFACES DESPITE ITS CONTINUAL BETRAYAL BY THOSE WHO ARE EMPOWERED TO CARRY IT OUT. I WANT TO ASK ONE LAST QUESTION...
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| 00:52:50 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
HER, WHO WAS THE FOUNDER OF HER SISTER WAS AN UNMARRIED WOMEN. SHE WAS A SINGLE WOMAN WHO DIDN'T COVER HER HAIR, FOUGHT AN ELECTION AGAINST THE TATER....
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| 00:54:14 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
THERE IS -- AN INCREDIBLE AMOUNT OF SPACE FOR HOPE FOR PAKISTAN. >> WHILE THE FACTORS TO LIVING THERE
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| 00:54:23 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
IS ONE ELEMENT OF THAT. LET'S TAKE SOME QUESTIONS FROM THE AUDIENCE. I'LL
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| 00:54:28 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
START HERE IN THE LOWEST REACHES. WE HAVE TO WAIT FOR THE MICROPHONE AND PLEASE BE BRIEF AND ASK A QUESTION. IF YOU'RE STANDING UP FOR THE PIECE OF...
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| 00:54:47 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
IT'S CLEAR THAT FIRST OF ALL IT WAS A PLEASURE TO LISTEN TO YOU. IT'S CLEAR THAT YOU LIKE ZARDARI. I JUST WANT YOU TO KNOW THAT WE DON'T LIKE THEM EITHER....
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| 00:55:22 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
ARE THE PEOPLE -- >> JUST EXPLAIN WHO HE IS TALKING ABOUT. >> COCHAIRMEN. >>
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| 00:55:32 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AND WHO IS JUNIOR TO YOU IN THE FAMILY? >> YES, I'M NOT QUALIFIED TO SPEAK BECAUSE I KNEW IT HAS IN ALSO SHOULD NOT OFFER AN OPINION OR >> WORTH
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| 00:55:42 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
A LIVING NOW? >> I DON'T KNOW. YOU'D BE BETTER OFF ASKING SOMEONE WHO'S WITHIN THAT PARTY I THINK. >> WILL MOVE
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| 00:55:49 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
US THIS FLIPSIDE, GENTLEMEN THERE. >> HI,
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| 00:55:55 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
THANKS. I THINK YOU QUITE PERSUASIVELY ARGUED BOTH IN YOUR BOOK AND IN YOUR COMMENTS THAT PAKISTAN IS CONFRONTED
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| 00:56:01 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
WITH TWO STARK CHOICES. ON THE ONE HAND YOU HAVE THIS MILITARY INDUSTRIAL COMPLEX THAT DOES NOT WANT TO CEDE POWER TO COMBAT HAS BEEN -- WE'VE SEEN...
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| 00:57:01 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
I DON'T -- I MEAN, I HAVE A POSTMODERN FUTILE IT -- [INAUDIBLE] [LAUGHTER] >> WHICH IS WHAT I WAS GETTING TOO. MEANS THAT ONE DOESN'T HAVE LAND ANY...
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| 00:57:20 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
A LIVING. BUT ABSOLUTELY I THINK ONE OF THE GREAT BETRAYALS HAS BEEN THE SCALING BACK ON THE LIFTING OF FEELINGS ON PRIVATE LAND. AND THERE WAS OF...
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| 00:58:39 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
RIGHT NOW. [INAUDIBLE] >> A QUICK QUESTION FOR -- A COMMENT. THE BRIEF THAT SHE READ FROM THE BOOK, SEVERAL YEARS AGO I HEARD THE STORY FROM
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| 00:58:54 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
ROBERT KENNEDY JUNIOR, TELLING ME THAT HIS SISTER'S ROOMMATE IN COLLEGE WAS TELLING HER THE STORY OF HER BROTHER'S ASSASSINATION. AND IT'S VERY INTERESTING...
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| 01:00:05 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
QUESTION. I THOUGHT ONE THING THAT'S IMPORTANT TO EMPHASIZE IN YOUR QUESTION WAS REALLY AN IMPORTANT SENSE OF DIRECTION BECAUSE A PROBLEM IS THAT AMERICAN...
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| 01:01:54 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
INVESTMENT, AND THERE ARE SO MANY POSSIBILITIES. BUT IF WE TALK ABOUT DIRECT INVESTMENT, I THINK ANYTHING THERE SUSTAINED AS OUTSIDE -- AND OUTSIDE...
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| 01:03:16 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
TO REACH. >> THANK YOU. IT SEEMS TO ME, JUST AS A CITIZEN IN HIS 60'S,
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| 01:03:28 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
VIEWING PAKISTAN, THAT THE UNITED STATES TREAT PAKISTAN IK TOPPING DOORS. WE SUPPORT THEM DURING RUSSIA'S OCCUPATION OF AFGHANISTAN. WE THEN ABANDON...
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| 01:04:16 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
POLITICAL AID. AMERICA HAS SUPPORTED EVERY SINGLE DICTATOR WE'VE EVER HAD. AND I IMAGINE WHEN WE HAVE OUR NEXT ONE THEY WILL CONTINUE TO SUPPORT HIM,...
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| 01:06:06 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
HERE IN NEW YORK TO 86 YEARS IN PRISON? AND IF YOU COULD COMMENT A BIT ON WHY SHE'S BEEN SUCH A NATIONAL ICON. >> I THINK SHE'S BECOME THE FACE OF...
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| 01:06:24 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
IN WHAT REMAINS A HIGHLY ILLEGAL WAY. AND THEN AGAIN, SHE IS ONE OF THOUSANDS OF CAPTURED, RIGHTLY SO I THINK PEOPLE'S ANGER. YOU KNOW, THERE'S A LOT...
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| 01:07:22 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
ON AN TOTAL OBSERVANCE, BUT OF THE VERY EDUCATED AND SUCCESSFUL PAKISTAN AND TO LIVE IN
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| 01:07:28 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
THIS COUNTRY AND ALSO FROM MY KNOWLEDGE OF PEOPLE WHO LIVE IN THE OLD, LIVE AND WORK IN THE GULF, HIS BRAIN DRAIN A BIG? AND IS THERE ANY WAY OF BRINGING...
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| 01:07:46 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
WHEN YOU SPEAK TO, YOU KNOW, PAKISTANIS WHO LIVE ABROAD AND WORK FOR DEVELOPMENT AGENCIES ARE BANKS OR WHATEVER HAVE YOU AROUND THE WORLD AND YOU ASK...
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| 01:08:23 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
I WOULD NEVER WILLINGLY RETURN TO THAT. AND I ALSO KNOW THAT IF WE LEAVE, IF PEOPLE LEAVE, IT'S VERY CLEAR WHOSE HANDS WE LEAVE THE COUNTRY AND I'M...
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| 01:08:50 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
LAST QUESTION. >> THANK YOU SO MUCH. I'M ACTUALLY REALLY AFRAID FOR YOU EVER SINCE I'VE BEEN LISTENING TO
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| 01:08:57 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
YOU. I THINK WE NEED YOUR VOICE AND IT'S QUITE RADICAL AS WELL AND QUITE ON POINT. SO I HOPE THAT YOU CONTINUE AND I HOPE THAT YOU -- I'M INTERESTED...
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| 01:12:38 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
INFORMATION, VISIT
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NOTE: The transcript for this program was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.