| 00:00:01 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
WOULD YOU TELL THE STORY ABOUT THE FELLOW THAT GOT ON THE MOTORCYCLE AND RODE THE ENTIRE CONTINENT OF AFRICA? >> THIS IS IS A STORY OF A MINING ENTREPRENEUR...
|
| 00:00:55 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
RODE THROUGH 15 COUNTRIES OVER ABOUT FIVE WEEKS. AND ABOUT 85% OF THE ROADS THAT HE RODE ON WERE TARRED,
|
| 00:01:03 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AS HE DESCRIBED, SORT OF CALIFORNIA STARRED. SO AMAZINGLY TARRED ROAD. AND HE COULDN'T QUITE UNDERSTAND WHY THAT WOULD BE THE CASE. I MUST SAY I MYSELF...
|
| 00:02:03 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AFRICAN CONTINENT AS PART OF CONTRACTS,
|
| 00:02:05 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
OR AS PART OF WAYS FOR THEM TO INVEST IN THE CONTINENT, PERHAPS SOMETIMES TO EXTRACT MINERALS, BUT ALSO IN GENERAL FOR THEM TO BE ABLE TO TRANSPORT GOODS...
|
| 00:02:40 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
BUILD ROADS OR RAILWAYS, IN RETURN THEY GET ACCESS TO MINERALS AND MINING AND PERHAPS SOMETIMES OIL AND GAS CONCESSIONS. SO IT'S BASICALLY IN RETURN...
|
| 00:02:51 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
TIMES IN YOUR BOOK CALLED "DEAD AID" I SAW THIS NAME, LUKE CUSS LONDON. >> YES. >> AND THEN I SAW ON THE WEBSITE THAT YOU HAVE BEEN NOMINATED TO...
|
| 00:03:12 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
YES. I MET THEM ACTUALLY ABOUT THREE AND A HALF YEARS AGO, AND
|
| 00:03:17 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
I COMMONLY SIT ON THEIR CHARETTED
|
| 00:03:19 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
BOARD AT THE CLINTON GLOBAL NISHFIVE I BELIEVE
|
| 00:03:24 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
IN 2007 AS PART OF
|
| 00:03:29 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
A PRESENTATION THAT WOULD BE MADE
|
| 00:03:31 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AT
|
| 00:03:33 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
THE CONFERENCE, OF WHICH I'M ONE OF THE BOARD MEMBERS, MADE A SIGNIFICANT PLEDGE TOWARD MICROFINANCE INITIATIVES ACROSS AFRICA. AND I HAVE BEEN PART...
|
| 00:04:19 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
HOPEFULLY COMING UP QUITE SOON. I WOULD LOOK -- KNOWING THEM AS I DO AND KNOWING THE OTHER BOARD MEMBERS, I KNOW THAT IT'S GOT NOTHING MORE TO DO...
|
| 00:04:35 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
ORGANIZATION. OF COURSE, YOU KNOW, MY BACKGROUND IS SOMEWHAT DIFFERENT IN THE SENSE THAT I'M A TRAINED ECONOMIST. MANY OF THE PEOPLE ON THE BOARD ...
|
| 00:05:15 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
STREET JOURNAL"
|
| 00:05:16 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
GAVE YOU A WHOLE EXCERPT, AN
|
| 00:05:18 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
EDITORIAL, THEY DID A BOOK REVIEW?
|
| 00:05:20 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
THEY COULDN'T DO ANY MORE. WHERE IS THAT COMING FROM SF >> I'M VERY, VERY GRATEFUL FOR THE ATTENTION THAT THE BOOK HAS GARNERED. I
|
| 00:05:29 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
THINK, I'M GRATEFUL AND FLATTERED IN THE SENSE THAT WE'RE IN THE MIDDLE OF ONE OF THE GREATEST ECONOMIC CRISISES OF GREATEST TIMES, AND SO TO GET THAT...
|
| 00:05:44 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AS A SOCIETY THAT THERE ARE OTHER INCREDIBLY PRESSING ISSUES ON THE TABLE, IT'S A GREAT THING. HOWEVER, OF COURSE I DO THINK THAT THERE ARE A NUMBER...
|
| 00:06:46 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
QUO. JUST LOOK AT THE AMOUNT OF FOCUS THAT WE'VE GIVEN TO CAPITALISTIC FREE MARKET SYSTEM. AND I THINK THAT THERE ARE MANY THINGS THAT PEOPLE ARE...
|
| 00:07:01 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
MAYBE WHAT WE THOUGHT WAS OK AND ACCEPTABLE IS NOT EXACTLY THE CASE. AND I THINK THE AID IS RIGHT UTCH THERE. WE'VE GOT INCLUSIVE BILLION PEOPLE LIVING...
|
| 00:07:47 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
HERE IN THE UNITED STATES BUT ALSO LIVING ABROAD
|
| 00:07:50 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AND WORKING IN MULTILATERAL AGENCIES SUCH AS THE WORLD BANK, BUT ALSO BLING IN THE INVESTMENT BANK. BUT ALSO, I MIGHT ADD HAVING BEEN TAUGHT BY THOSE...
|
| 00:08:30 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
TIME. >> THAT'S RIGHT. I'VE BEEN THERE FOR EIGHT YEARS. BUT I MEAN, I WAS VERY HAPPY. I MUST SAY, IT WASN'T
|
| 00:08:38 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
SORT OF A SLAM DUNK. I THINK THAT THERE WERE ISSUES ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT THERE WAS APPETITE FOR THIS TYPE OF SUBJECT AND, REALLY, WHAT WAS THERE GOING...
|
| 00:08:49 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
BE A FUNDMENTAL
|
| 00:08:51 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
MESSAGE. I WAS GRATEFUL NOT TO HAVE A NEGATIVE MESSAGE. >> GO BACK TO WHAT YOU WERE DOING. WERE YOU IN LONDON? >> YES. >> AND WHAT WAS YOUR JOB?...
|
| 00:09:15 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
SOUTH AFRICA AND BOTS
|
| 00:09:17 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
WANNA. SO HERE WE HAVE
|
| 00:09:20 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
MERGING ECONOMIES THAT I WAS ACCESSING TO
|
| 00:09:23 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AND I ALSO SPENT TIME AT THE WORLD BANK WHERE I WAS WORKING WITH MORE SORT OF CHALLENGED, ECONOMICICALLY CHALLENGED COUNTRIES. SO IT WAS A REAL OPPORTUNITY...
|
| 00:10:12 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
BANKS TO ACT AS BROKERS SO THAT THESE COUNTRIES OR COMPANIES CAN BE INTRODUCED TO PEOPLE, INVESTORS WHO
|
| 00:10:20 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
WOULD BE INTERESTED. >> BOTS WANNA, ONE OF SEVERAL COUNTRIES. HAD YOU EVER BEEN THERE? >> YES. AND COMPLETELY DIFFERENT SITUATION THAN MY COUNTRY....
|
| 00:10:48 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
FOCUSING ON FREE MARKETS AND MORE CAPITALISTIC
|
| 00:10:51 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
APPROACH TO ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT. AND ALSO HAVING A VERY CLEAR AND OPEN DEMOCRATIC SOCIETY, VERY DIFFERENT FROM THE REST OVERT OF THE COUNT NENT. AGGRESSIVELY,...
|
| 00:11:33 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
WELL. IT'S A
|
| 00:11:34 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
RELATIVELY SMALL COUNTRY BUT IT'S DEFINITELY VERY FOCUSED IN TERMS OF GENERATING LONG-TERM DEVELOPMENT AND REDUCING POVERTY. AND SCAPARETTED TO SAY...
|
| 00:12:10 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
YEARS WHEN OVER A TRILLION DOLLARS HAS GONE TO AFRICA. THEY DON'T SEND CHILDREN TO
|
| 00:12:17 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
SCHOOL. PEOPLE FEEL THAT THE -- THERE'S VERY LITTLE LONG-TERM BENEFIT BECAUSE THE COUNTRY ISN'T GROWING SO THERE ISN'T A JOB OPPORTUNITY FOR THEIR DAUGHTER,...
|
| 00:13:15 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
WAS IT? >> ZAMBIA WAS A BRITISH COLONY, IT WAS
|
| 00:13:20 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
CALLED NORTHERN RODEESHA AND GAINED INDEPENDENCE IN 1964. >> WHY DID THESE TWO COUNTRIES DEVELOP DIFFERENTLY? >> CLEARLY, LEADERSHIP HAS SOMETHING...
|
| 00:13:33 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
TO THE 1960'S, IT WAS THE PERIOD WHERE WE, AS IN GLOBAL SOCIETY,
|
| 00:13:38 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
WERE ENTHRALLED AND PERHAPS TAKEN BY THE NOTION THAT GOVERNMENTS COULD AND SHOULD INTERVENE. I MYSELF BELIEVED
|
| 00:13:46 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
THAT IT IS CRITICALLY IMPORTANT FOR GOVERNMENTS
|
| 00:13:49 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
TO BE INVOLVED AND TAKE A LEADERSHIP ROLE IN DESIGNING LONG-TERM DEVELOPMENT POLICIES AND STRATEGIES. BUT I THINK WHAT HAS HAPPENED IS THAT THE WORLD...
|
| 00:14:38 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
WAS TOWARDS OTHER PEOPLE. >> I-ARE SITTING AT YOUR DOVEG. YOU ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR
|
| 00:14:44 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
BOTS WANNA. HOW DOES IT WORK? DID SOMEBODY CALL YOU OR DID YOU CALL THEM? AND WHAT -- IN COMMON LAYMAN'S TERMS. >> SURE. IT'S A RELATIONSHIP THAT...
|
| 00:15:02 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
WERE WAYS TO BRIDGE GAPS, TO CEMENT THE GAPS. SO, FOR
|
| 00:15:12 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
EXAMPLE, IF YOU'RE A GOVERNMENT AND YOU'RE LOOKING TO FIND SCHOOLS, ROADS, HEALTH CARE, YOU MIGHT SAY, I CAN GET SOME OF THAT MONEY FROM TAXES, MAYBE...
|
| 00:15:52 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
RAISED IN THE COLONIAL PERIOD. THEY WERE RELATIVELY YOUNG WHEN THESE COUNTRIES ACHIEVED INDEPENDENCE. THEY CAME LIKE OBAMA'S
|
| 00:16:00 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
FATHER TO THE UNITED STATES ON SCHOLARSHIP TO FURTHER THEIR EDUCATION. THEY WERE INCREDIBLY EXCITED ABOUT GOING BACK TO AFRICA. IT WAS A TURNING...
|
| 00:16:58 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
ON TRYING TO BRING STUDENTS FROM INTERNATIONAL STUDENTS BUT ALSO FROM AFRICA. SO MY FATHER ACTUALLY
|
| 00:17:05 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
GOT A SCHOLARSHIP WHILE HE WAS A STUDENT AT THE UNIVERSITY OF ZAMBIA. >> WHERE WERE YOU BORN? >> I WAS BORN IN ZAMBIA. >> SO YOU LIVED IN THE UNITED...
|
| 00:17:33 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
SO VERY MUCH MY
|
| 00:17:35 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
PURVIEW ON THE WAY THE
|
| 00:17:36 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
WORLD WORKS WAS STRUCTURED
|
| 00:17:38 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AND BASED IN ZAMBIA. >> WHAT KIND OF FOOMLY DID YOUR PARENTS -- FAMILY DID YOUR PARENTS LIVE IN AND WHY WERE THEY INTERESTED IN GOING TO SCHOOL IN THE...
|
| 00:18:02 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
IS VERY SIMILAR TO THE APARTHEID. SOMEWHERE BLACKS WERE NOT ALLOWED TO SORT OF WALK AROUND ANYWHERE. THEY HAD TO GO WITH THE PASSES. MY FATHER...
|
| 00:18:13 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
SON OF A MINER. MY MOTHER WAS, IS THE DAUGHTER OF MY LATE GRAND FATHER, MALT NAL GRAND FATHER PASSED AWAY BUT HE LATER IN LIFE BECAME A TEACHER. THEY...
|
| 00:19:21 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
ATTITUDE. OBVIOUSLY, AMERICANS WORK HARD. THEY BELIEVE IN ENTREPRENEURSHIP, THEY
|
| 00:19:25 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
BELIEVE IN INNOVATION. ANYBODY AND ANYONE CAN AND DO APPLY FOR -- IT'S INCREDIBLY DRIVEN BY THIS ASPECT, WHICH I THINK PROBABLY PER VADED AFRICA...
|
| 00:20:08 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
SUBSEQUENTLY WENT TO HARVARD
|
| 00:20:10 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
ON SCHOLARSHIP. >> GO BACK OVER. AT THE UNIVERSITY OF ZAMBIA, YOU GOT WHAT DEGREE? >> WE HAD AN ATTEMPTED COUP. I WAS STUDYING CHEMISTRY. THE UNIVERSITY...
|
| 00:20:34 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AT AMERICAN UNIVERSITY. YES. AND SO I STAID THERE ARE FOR A COUPLE OF YEARS,
|
| 00:20:39 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
COMPLETED MY UNDERGRADUATE DEGREE, WORKED AT THE WORLD BANK, AND SPENT SEVERAL YEARS IN WASHINGTON. >> WERE WERE YOU? >> I WAS BASED HERE IN
|
| 00:20:53 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
WASHINGTON, D.C. AND I ALSO WORKED ON
|
| 00:20:55 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
SOMETHING CALLED THE WORLD DEVELOPMENT REPORT WHICH COMES OUT EVERY YEAR. I WORKED ON THE ONE FOR 1994 WHICH FOUSEKD ON THAT. >> TO GO TO THE MOMENT,...
|
| 00:21:10 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
SOMEHOW OR ANOTHER
|
| 00:21:12 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
DISBURSE $1.1 TRILLION. WHEN YOU SAW THAT FIGURE AND LOOKED AT THE, WHATEVER YOU CAN FIND IN THE FINE PRINT WHAT WAS YOUR REACTION? >> I THINK THE POINT...
|
| 00:21:25 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
IF THIS IS BAILOUT SUPPORT, OR IF THIS IS MORE OF THE SAME OPEN-ENDED COMMITMENTS THAT HAVE BEEN GOING TO AFRICA IN PARTICULAR. I BELIEVE THAT THERE...
|
| 00:21:41 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
OF EASTERN EUROPE RIGHT NOW, WHICH MANY COUNTRIES ARE GOING THROUGH SOME SIGNIFICANT CHALLENGES IN TERMS OF PAYMENTS AND CURRENCY CRISIS. IT...
|
| 00:23:10 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
INDICATORS THAT WE HAVE OF CORRUPTION ACTIVITIES. BUT THAT'S REALLY BASED ON PEOPLE'S PERCEPTIONS.
|
| 00:23:17 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
HOWEVER, IT'S VIRTUALLY POSSIBLE TO ESTIMATE WHO IS THE MOST CORRUPT. BUT I THINK THAT BROADLY SPEAKING, THAT'S A GOOD INDICATOR. >> THE REASON I ASK,...
|
| 00:23:47 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
COMPLEX. I THINK THAT THE FACT THAT THERE'S AN AMERICAN AMBASSADOR THERE AND A BRITISH HIGH COMMISSION THRER MEANS THAT THERE'S OBVIOUSLY ONGOING RELATIONSHIP,...
|
| 00:24:01 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
TO ACTUALLY TRY TO ADDRESS THAT TYPE OF SITUATION. I TALK ABOUT IN THE BOOK THE FACT THAT THE BRITISH GOVERNMENT AND THE AMERICAN GOVERNMENT AS LATE...
|
| 00:24:58 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
WOULD WE KEEP GIVING MONEY TO ALL THESE COUNTRIES? >> I DON'T WANT TO CAST DISPERSIANS. THAT'S THE QUESTION AMERICAN
|
| 00:25:05 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
PEOPLE SHOULD BE ASKING THEIR GOVERNMENT.
|
| 00:25:08 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AND THE WESTERN SOCIETY AS A WHOLE SHOULD BE ASKING THEIR POLICY MAKERS. MUG ABIE IN A SENSE WE KNOW IS NOT THE FIRST TO BE IN THIS. AFRICA, THE HISTORIAN...
|
| 00:25:22 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AND LONG LIST OF AFRICAN TIRNCAL AND CORRUPT LEADERS. IT'S NOT EVERYBODY. THERE'S SOME VERY, VERY GOOD AFRICAN LEADERS. BUT AT THE SAME TIME, WE ALL...
|
| 00:26:01 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
JOB. VERY, VERY CHALLENGING
|
| 00:26:04 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
CONDITIONS. THIS IS AN EXAMPLE OF A COUNTRY THAT'S 70% DEPENDENT ON AID. THIS IS THE 15TH YEAR AFTER THE GENOCIDE. HERE'S A LEADER WHO COULD GUILT...
|
| 00:27:04 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
ABOUT HOW AID IS NOT GOING TO BE
|
| 00:27:06 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
THE BIG IMPETUS TO MOVE AFRICA FORWARD. SO THERE ARE SOME VERY GOOD LEADERS. >> THERE'S 1 MILLION PEOPLE. YOU DIDN'T MENTION NIGERIA, WHICH IS THE BIGGEST...
|
| 00:27:36 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
THAT THE BOOK CRITICIZED AS AN AID MODEL ARE THINGS THAT QUITE AFFILIATED WITH RESOURCE, SUCH AS NIGERIA. NOW, THAT BEING SAID THERE HAS BEEN SOME
|
| 00:27:50 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
PROGRESS IN NIGERIA. THEY HAD DEMOCRATIC ELECTIONS. THEY HAVE A VERY FOCUSED PLAN, AT LEAST THEY'RE GIVING LIP SERVICE TO A FOCUSED PLANCH ON TRYING...
|
| 00:28:41 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AFRICAN CHILD SHE WAS TRYING TO ADOPT. AND THERE'S SOME KIND OF DIFFICULTY. ANGELINA IS IN THE NEWS ALL THE TIME ABOUT GOING TO AFRICA. I KNOW YOU'VE...
|
| 00:29:20 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AFRICA. I THINK THEY'RE WRONG. I DO THINK THAT THE CELEBRITY CULTURE AS A WHOLE IS A RED HERRING.
|
| 00:29:25 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
IT'S NOT THAT INTERESTING. THERE
|
| 00:29:27 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
ARE MORE INTERESTING THINGS TO BE WORRIED ABOUT. I ALSO WORRY ON A SECOND POINT THAT THE CELEBRITIES HAVE BECOME THE FACE OF AFRICA, AND IT BEGS THE...
|
| 00:31:25 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
DO MAKE SOME MONEY THROUGH
|
| 00:31:27 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
THE WORLD PEACE. IT'S NOT AN ENORMOUS AMOUNT. IT TENDS TO BE WHAT I NEED. >> WHERE DO YOU LIVE NOW? >> I LIVE IN LONDON. I'VE LIVED IN LONDON FOR...
|
| 00:31:41 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
PLANE. ABOUT FOUR OR FIVE TIMES TO ZAMBIA IN PARTICULAR, BUT SPEND A LOT OF TIME
|
| 00:31:46 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
IN AFRICA. I WAS JUST IN RWANDA IN FEBRUARY. SO I DO SPEND A LOT OF TIME ON THE AFRICAN CONTINENT. >> DO YOU STILL
|
| 00:31:53 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
REPRESENT ANYBODY IN THE FINANCIAL
|
| 00:31:55 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
WORLD? >> NO. I SPENT EIGHT WONDERFUL YEARS WORKING IN FINANCE. I LEARNED A LOT AND IT JUST BECAME INCREDIBLY DIFFICULT TO WRITE THE BOOK, AND...
|
| 00:32:13 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
NAME GOLD MAN SASMS HAS VARIOUS REACTIONS TO THE AMERICAN PEOPLE.
|
| 00:32:18 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
IT'S ONE OF THE FINANCIAL INSTITUTIONS IN THE WORLD THAT'S VERY CONFUSED RIGHT NOW. IS IT GOOD OR BAD THAT YOU WORK THERE RIGHT NOY? WHEN WE STARTED...
|
| 00:32:33 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AGAIN LABELS TEND TO DETRACT FROM WHY I'M HERE. I THINK IT'S A FANTASTIC COMPANY. I LEARNED A LOT ABOUT THE WAY THE MARKETS WORK AND I WON'T BE ABLE...
|
| 00:32:53 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
USUALLY DETRACTS FROM MY MESSAGE IN MY BOOK, WHICH IS ONE ABOUT AFRICA. AND ITS DEVELOPMENT PROSPECTS, AND WHAT NEEDS TO BE DONE TO GET THIS CONTINENT...
|
| 00:33:23 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
THE AID-BASED MODELS OF AID BASED INTERVENTIONS TO AFRICA
|
| 00:33:28 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
WERE NOT WORKING. HERE WAS A PROFESSOR TALKING ABOUT HIS EXPERIENCES IN THESE EMERGING ECONOMIES WHICH HAVE NOT ADOMTED THE AID MODEL. >> BEFORE WE...
|
| 00:33:59 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AND BASICALLY TO DRAW ON PEOPLE'S INTERESTS ON PERSPECTIVES OVER THE PAST SIX YEARS WHERE THIS AID DEBATE HAS GONE. SO I DO TALK ABOUT MANY
|
| 00:34:07 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
PEOPLE WHO
|
| 00:34:08 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
HAVE BEEN PRIMARILY AGAINST THE SYSTEM OF AID DEPENDENCY, WHO
|
| 00:34:13 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
WERE BASICALLY MANY OF THEM WERE OSTRICIZED FROM THE MAINSTREAM DEBATE. >> PAUL COLLIER? >> SO I'M NOT THE FIRST PERSON TO CRITICIZE AID. TO CRITICIZE...
|
| 00:34:40 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
BACK IN THE 1950'S AND OF 0'S WHO CHALLENGED THE STATUS QUO. >> WHO WAS HE? >> HE WAS
|
| 00:34:49 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
A HUNGARIAN BORN ECONOMIST WHO SPENT A NUMBER OF YEARS IN MALAYSIA AND IN NIGERIA AND OTHER EMERGING ECONOMIES. HE WROTE EXTENSIVELY ABOUT THE ...
|
| 00:35:06 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
WORLD WAS VERY MUCH IN LOVE WITH THE IDEA OF THE
|
| 00:35:10 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
MARSHALL PLAN. HE VERY LATER BECAME MUCH MORE ACCEPTED IN THE MAIN STREEM AFTER THE THEN PRIME MINISTER MARGARET THATCHER BASICALLY GAVE HIM A TITLE...
|
| 00:36:01 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
SINCE THE COLONIAL PERIOD CHANGED. SO AFTER INDEPENDENCE, HE'S TALKED ABOUT HOW SOME
|
| 00:36:08 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AFRICAN COUNTRIES HAVE BECOME WORSE THAN UNDER THE CLONE YL PERIOD. I DON'T SUBSCRIBE COMPLETELY TO -- CLEARLY THE EVIDENCE IS THERE THAT AFRICAN...
|
| 00:36:49 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
IS CONCERNED. HE'S VERY MUCH AN ADVOCATE
|
| 00:36:52 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
OF THE AID INTERVENTIONIST APPROACH. HE ALSO HAS GOT SOME RESPONSIBILITIES THROUGH THE UNITED NATION, THE MILLENIUM DEVELOPMENT GOALS ARE BASICALLY...
|
| 00:37:39 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
INCENTIVES ACROSS THE CONTINENT. AND THAT IS FUNDAMENTALLY THE PROBLEM. IF THERE WERE A WAY TO ENSURE POSITIVE OUTCOMES, I PROBABLY WOULDN'T BE HERE....
|
| 00:37:51 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
IS WE'VE TRIED THAT. WE'VE TRIED CONDITION NALTS, WE'VE TRIED TO CURB GOVERNMENT BEHAVIOR AROUND AID MONEYS AND IT HASN'T WORKED. >> WE AS AMERICANS...
|
| 00:38:21 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AND THINKING HOW ARE WE GOING TO GET INVOLVED HERE? BUT IT'S NOT APPROPRIATE TO BE PUSHING A MODEL THAT HAS NOT WORKED ANYWHERE ON EARTH. THERE IS...
|
| 00:38:32 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
POVERTY AND GENERATED LONG-TERM GROWTH BY RELYING ON AID TO THE EXTENT THAT AFRICA DOES TODAY. AND THAT IS WHAT HAS BEEN MISSING WITH THIS DISCUSSION....
|
| 00:39:11 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
HELP DEVELOPMENT ADVOCACY IN AFRICA. THIS INFORMATION WAS PROVIDED BY GLOVER PARK GROUP. AND I'VE GOT 20 POINTS HERE. FIRST OF ALL, WHO IS BONO? I...
|
| 00:39:45 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
MUCH AWARE, VI NOT SEEN THE POINTS, BY THE WAY, BUT I AM AWARE THAT MEMBERS OF HIS ORGANIZATION ARE USING LIES AND FALSEHOODS, FOR EXAMPLE, CLAIMING...
|
| 00:41:01 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
COURSE BORK AND AT THE END OF IT YOU GET A DEGREE. IT'S NOT OPEN-ENDED, FOR EXAMPLE, AS OPPOSED TO AID GOING TO AFRICA. AND
|
| 00:41:09 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
BESIDES, I WOULD HOPE THAT WE DO AGREE, WHETHER IT'S BONO'S GROUP OR GATES FOUNDATION OR MYSELF, THAT WE DON'T EXPECT AFRICA TO BE ON AID FOREVER. SO...
|
| 00:41:50 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
COUPS. THERE ARE MANY, A NUMBER OF FAILED STATES, LIKE SOMALIA. MANY PEOPLE ARE REFUGEES FROM THE POLITICAL CIVIL
|
| 00:41:59 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
WARS. AFRICA HAD MORE CIVIL WARS IN THE 1990'S THAN THE REST OF THE WORLD PUT TOGETHER. SO, UNFORTUNATELY, BECAUSE WE'VE CONTINUED TO SPIRAL DOWNWARDS...
|
| 00:42:38 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
COUNTRIES AROUND THE WORLD SFLR GOING BACK TO THE POINT OF INCENTIVES. SOCIETIES, GOVERNMENT AND INDIVIDUALS ARE DRIVEN BY
|
| 00:42:45 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
INCENTIVES. SO THE UNITED STATES GOVERNMENT FOREIGN POLICY IS NOT SO
|
| 00:42:51 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
OBSCURE FOR US TO NOT UNDERSTAND THAT VERY OFTEN THE UNITED STATES WILL STEP IN WHEN THERE ARE THINGS TO DO THAT ARE IN THE INTEREST OF THE AMERICAN...
|
| 00:43:45 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
IN. I DON'T HAVE THE EXACT NUMBER RIGHT NOW, BUT I THINK THERE THERE ARE MANY AFRICAN GOVERNMENTS THAT HAVE BEEN IN POWER FOR 30 OR 40 YEARS. >> WHO...
|
| 00:43:58 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
FOR EXAMPLE, YOU GANDA. BUT THAT'S JUST ONE EXAMPLE. >> WHAT CATEGORY DO YOU -- DO YOU THINK OF EGYPT AS BEING IN AFRICA? >> THE REASON WHY I
|
| 00:44:14 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
DON'T INCLUDE EGYPT IS NOT BECAUSE
|
| 00:44:16 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
THEY'RE NOT ON THE AFRICAN CONTINENT. OF COURSE THEY ARE. BUT THE NATURE OF THEIR INTERACTION AND TRADE HAS TRADITIONALLY BEEN ONE -- IN FACT INDEED...
|
| 00:44:29 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
ARE NOT SIMILAR TO THE SORT OF GENERAL MA LAYS THAT WE'VE SEEN ON THE REST OF
|
| 00:44:34 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
THE CONTINENT. >> WHAT DO YOU THINK IF AMERICANS GIVE $2 BILLION A YEAR TO EGYPT? >> EGYPT AS A ECONOMY DOES NOT RELY ON AID FOR LONG-TERM DEVELOPMENT...
|
| 00:44:57 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
LIST PROVIDED TO US BY THE PEOPLE WORKING FOR
|
| 00:45:02 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
BONO. >> I'M SURPRISED THEY DIDN'T SEND IT TO ME. >> THEY DID NOT USE YOUR NAME IN HERE, BY THE WAY. ALSO, THIS IS JUST FACTS AS THEY SEE IT THAT...
|
| 00:45:17 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
INCREASED AID, THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE ON LIFE-SAVING
|
| 00:45:23 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
ANTI-RETRO VIRAL DRUGS INCREASED
|
| 00:45:26 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
FROM 50,000 IN 2002 TO 2.1 MILLION IN 2007. >> WHOSE RESPONSIBILITY IS IT TO PROVIDE HEALTH CARE TO AFRICANS? IS IT THE RESPONSIBILITY OF ONE ORGANIZATION?...
|
| 00:45:53 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
TO PROVIDE HEALTH CARE? YES, IT'S TRUE THAT THOSE INTERVENTIONS HAVE, DO ALLEVIATE SOME POVERTY. I MYSELF SIT ON A NUMBER OF CHARITY BOARDS. AS I SAID....
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| 00:46:33 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AGAIN, DON'T QUIBBLE WITH THOSE NUMBERS. BUT AS I'VE TOLD THE BONO'S ORGANIZATION WHO REPRESENTS THIS ORGANIZATION BEFORE, THERE ARE CONFLICTING...
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| 00:46:45 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
ARE BAND-AID SOLUTIONS. BUT WE CANNOT EXPECT THE AFRICAN GOVERNMENT TO ABDICATE THEIR RESPONSIBILITY FOR PROVIDING EDUCATION AND HEALTH CARE BECAUSE...
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| 00:47:30 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
TRADING FLOORS AND THERE'S PEOPLE FROM ALL AROUND THE WORLD, EASTERN EUROPEANS, CHINESE, FROM OTHER PARTS OF ASIA, FROM SOUTH AMERICA. AND I THOUGHT,...
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| 00:47:48 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AFRICANS TO THE PROCESS. IT'S NOT JUST THERE. IT WAS WHEN I WAS AT OXFORD OR HARVARD OR EVEN AT THE WORLD BANK, THAT HERE WE ARE IN THE 21ST CENTURY...
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| 00:48:43 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
RELATIVELY LOW KEY MEETING, PERHAPS OVER TEA AND SCONES. IT ENDED UP BEING A VERY AGGRESSIVE PITCH. THERE WERE SIX PEOPLE FROM THEIR
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| 00:48:51 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
MARKETING SALES FROM THE PUBLISHERS, EDITORS AND SO ON, WHO BASICALLY SAT ME DOWN AND SAID, ORKS TELL US WHAT YOUR IDEA IS. BUT WE WANT TO GET MORE...
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| 00:49:59 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
BUT I THINK WHAT HE HAS DONE IS QUITE REMARKABLE. AND HE TOOK AN INTEREST IN MY WORK.
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| 00:50:04 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
HE OFFERED TO READ THE BOOK BEFORE IT WAS PUBLISHED, WHICH HE DID. AND HE WAS VERY SUPPORTIVE IN THE IDEAS. AND HE MAY NOT AGREE WITH EVERYTHING IN MY...
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| 00:50:49 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
YOUR OWN? >> NO. THIS CAN NEVER BE AN INDIVIDUAL PROJECT. ONE OF THE PEOPLE I TALK ABOUT IN THE BOOK AND THE PRESS IS MY BEST FRIEND, WHO WAS BORN...
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| 00:51:06 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
HOPKINS. >> NAME >> HER NAME IS
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| 00:51:08 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
IRIS. AND SHE DID
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| 00:51:09 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
A MASTERS IN LAW AT CORN YELL. SHE DECIDED TO GO -- CORN ELL. SHE DECIDED TO GO BACK TO ZAMBIA AND HAS WORKED IN THE HEALTH SECTOR AND DEALING WITH...
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| 00:51:26 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
THE PET FAR PROGRAM WHICH IS
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| 00:51:28 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
THE AMERICAN BASED PRESIDENTIAL PROGRAM TO HELP WITH HIV AIDS, AND SHE IS A REMARKABLE PERSON WHO VERY, VERY CAPABLE BUT WAS INCREDIBLY FRUSTRATED...
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| 00:52:32 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
IMPRESSED BY ALL THAT. MAYBE I'VE GONE TOO FAR WITH THAT BUT WHITES HAVE BEEN CRITICIZED FOR ENDORSING YOU FOR THEIR OWN REASONS. WHERE DO YOU FEEL...
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| 00:53:09 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
THE GREATEST AMOUNT OF CRITICISM AND THE MOST SORT OF VIRULENT TYPE OF CRITICISM HAS COME FROM PEOPLE WHO ARE NOT AFRICAN, VERY, VERY OFTEN FROM THE...
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| 00:53:47 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
VERY OBVIOUS BASED ON LODGIC
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| 00:53:49 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AND EVIDENCE, AID HASN'T WORKED. WE HAVE A LOT OF EVIDENCE THAT OTHER FORMS OF OTHER SOLUTIONS OTHER PRESCRIPTIONS HAVE WORKED FOR DEVELOPMENT. RATHER...
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| 00:54:42 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
OBJECTIVELY. IT'S A DIFFICULT TASK. OBVIOUSLY THERE ARE LA
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| 00:54:46 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
LOT OF INTERESTS THAT WILL SAY IGNORE THIS. BUT I HOPE HE LOOKS THROUGH THOSE TYPE OF ATTITUDES AND ISSUES AND BASICALLY TAKES A FRESH LOOK AT THIS...
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| 00:55:15 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
YOU WANT TO BE PERSONALLY? WHAT DO YOU WANT TO BE DOING IN TEN
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| 00:55:19 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
YEARS? >> I WISH I KNEW. I DO HOPE THAT THIS ISSUE OF AID
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| 00:55:22 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
TO AFRICA WOULD
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| 00:55:23 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
HAVE BEEN TRANSFORMED SIGNIFICANTLY IN THE SENSE THAT I THINK, I HOPE PEOPLE WILL SAY YES IT HASN'T WORKED, LET'S TRY AND DO SOMETHING MORE INNOVATIVE....
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| 00:55:34 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
CONTRIBUTED IN TERMS OF A DEBATE. I'M NOT COMPLETELY SANG WIN, I MUST SAY. I DO WORRY
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| 00:55:39 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
THAT IT'S GOING TO BE A NICE READ AND TOSSED INTO THE BACKGROUND. BUT I'M ALSO VERY HOPEFUL THAT WE ARE AT A TIME WHEN PEOPLE ARE OPEN TO NEW IDEAS AND...
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NOTE: The transcript for this program was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.