| 00:00:14 |
Host, -
BY PAUL HELMKE, PRESIDENT OF THE BRADY CAMPAIGN TO PREVENT GUN VIOLENCE. TO BOTH OF YOU, WELCOME. >> Guest: THANK YOU. NICE TO BE HERE. >> Host: MR....
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| 00:00:40 |
Guest, -
THAT ARE ASKED AND ANSWERED.
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| 00:00:43 |
Host, -
BUT, THE SENSE THEY GOT FROM THE JUSTICES AND I THINK A LOT OF THE COVERAGE POINTS THIS OUT IS SOME SKEPTICISM ABOUT THE MILITIA VIEW OF THE SECOND AMENDMENT,...
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| 00:00:57 |
Guest, -
AFTER SOME DISCUSSIONS ON THAT PRETTY QUICKLY MOVING TO WHAT SORT OF REASONABLE REGULATION MIGHT BE ALLOWED IF THERE IS IS AN INDIVIDUAL RIGHT VIEW, HOW...
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| 00:01:56 |
Host, -
D.C. COULD STILL WIN. EVEN WITH THAT VIEW. D.C., THE DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA HAS MADE THE ARGUMENT THAT EVEN IF IT IS AN INDIVIDUAL RIGHT, THAT THEIRS IS...
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| 00:02:06 |
Guest, -
REGULATION AND THERE WAS A LOT OF DISCUSSION ON THAT. THEY COULD SAY IT'S AN INDIVIDUAL RIGHT, D.C. LOSES BUT THERE ARE STILL REASONABLE REGULATIONS THAT...
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| 00:02:51 |
Host, -
MILITIA, FOR EXAMPLE, IF THE RIGHT IS OF THE PEOPLE, JUST LIKE IN THE FIRST AMENDMENT RIGHT TO -- THE PEOPLE TO ASSEMBLE OR THE FOURTH AMENDMENT RIGHT...
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| 00:02:59 |
Guest, -
AGAINST UNREASONABLE SEARCHES AND SEIZURES. WE ALSO HAVE VERY EARLY ON JUSTICE KENNEDY STATING AND THEN REPEATEDLY STATING, INTERESTINGLY, WELL, WHAT...
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| 00:05:55 |
Host, -
AT THE TIME OF WORLD WAR I, FOR EXAMPLE, EUGENE
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| 00:06:00 |
Guest, -
DIBBS SPENT TIME IN PRISON, FOR EXAMPLE, BUT THEN THE COURT STARTED SAYING THE FIRST AMENDMENT IS A FUNDAMENTAL RIGHT AND SINCE THAT TIME, AS YOU KNOW...
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| 00:06:43 |
Host, -
A SCENT OR YELL "FIRE" IN A CROWDED THEATER FRCHLT A PRACTICAL STANDPOINT,
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| 00:06:47 |
Guest, -
THE LEGAL ISSUES ARE FASCINATING, THE THEORETICAL ISSUES ARE FASCINATING. OUR CONCERN IS WHAT SORT OF GUN LAWS CAN COMMUNITIES, STATES, THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT...
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| 00:07:47 |
Host, -
WALTER DELLINGER WHO ARGUED FOR THE DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA. >> DO YOU THINK THE SECOND CLAUSE, THE OPERATIVE CAUSE, IS RELATED TO SOMETHING OTHER THAN...
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| 00:08:13 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
OF THE REMOTE SETTLOR TO DEFEND HIMSELF AND HIS FAMILY AGAINST HOSTILE INDIAN TRIBES AND
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| 00:08:19 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
OUTLAWS, WOLVES AND BEARS AND GRIZZLYS AND THINGS LIKE THAT? >> THAT IS NOT THE DISCOURSE THAT IS PART OF THE SECOND AMENDMENT. AND, WHEN YOU READ...
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| 00:08:32 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
KEEP AND BEAR ARMS IS A MILITARY PHRASE -- >> -- THOUGHT IT WAS IMPORTANT. HE THOUGHT THE RIGHT OF SELF-DEFENSE WAS INHERENT AND THE FRAMERES WERE...
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| 00:08:45 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
JOSEPH STORY, THE FIRST COMMENTATOR OF THE CONSTITUTION AND MEMBER OF THIS COURT THOUGHT IT WAS A PERSONAL GUARANTEE. >> WHEN BLACKSTONE SPEAKS OF THE...
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| 00:08:58 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
DESCRIBES IT AS ONE OF A USE OF WEAPON A COMMON LAW RIGHT AND IF WE ARE CONSTITUTIONALIZING THE BLACKSTONEIAN RIGHT -- IT APPLIES TO SUCH WEAPONS,...
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| 00:09:16 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
THE DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA PASSED. >> WELL, THAT MAY BE TRUE. BUT THAT CONCEDES YOUR MAIN POINT THAT THERE IS AN INDIVIDUAL RIGHT AND GETS TO THE SEPARATE...
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| 00:09:39 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
WELL. OUR FIRST CALL COMES FROM ALPINE, WYOMING. GOOD MORNING. >> Caller: GOOD MORNING. UH, I'VE JUST GOT A COUPLE QUESTIONS
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| 00:09:50 |
Host, -
HERE. WHEN DID THE RIGHT OF THE STATE TO HAVE A CIVILIAN MILITIA TO PROTECT STATES' RIGHTS ALL OF A SUDDEN HAVE GOVERNMENT -- FEDERAL GOVERNMENT CONTROL...
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| 00:10:07 |
Caller, -
CONTROL OF FEDERAL GOVERNMENT WAS SUPPOSED TO BE YOU COULD FIGHT THE GOVERNMENT IF THE GOVERNMENT GETS OUT OF CONTROL. SO, I DON'T UNDERSTAND THIS...
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| 00:11:14 |
Host, -
CONSTITUTION, THE
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| 00:11:15 |
Guest, -
STATES WERE CONCERNED ABOUT THE STRONG FEDERAL GOVERNMENT. THEY WANTED TO MAKE SURE THEY COULD KEEP THEIR STATE MILITIAS INTACT AS A COUNTERBALANCE...
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| 00:13:47 |
Host, -
DELLINGER SAID D.C. HAS A HIGH MURDER RATE AND EVERYTHING AND WHY SHOULDN'T THE CITY COUNCIL BE EMPOWERED TO BASICALLY BAN HANDGUN AND I BELIEVE IT...
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| 00:14:03 |
Guest, -
LAW-ABIDING CITIZEN TO PROTECT YOURSELF FROM CRIMINALS. D.C. NOT EVERY YEAR BUT SOME YEAR IS CALLED THE MURDER CAPITAL OF THE COUNTRY AND IT'S A SHAME...
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| 00:16:34 |
Host, -
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| 00:16:35 |
Caller, -
CITIZENS, WHAT WOULD THE BACKLASH BE FOR ME SAY HERE IN KANSAS CITY WHO WOULD LIKE TO KEEP OWNING MY HANDGUNS BECAUSE I'M A LAW-ABIDING CITIZEN BECAUSE...
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| 00:17:20 |
Guest, -
PEOPLE. I THINK NORMAL PEOPLE WHEN THEY SEE THOSE WORDS THE RIGHT OF THE PEOPLE THEY THINK I'M A HUMAN BEING AND PART OF THE PEOPLE IN THE U.S. AND HAVE...
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| 00:18:15 |
Guest, -
KNOW. IT'S A POLITICAL DECISION, IN OTHER WORDS, ONE WHERE POLICY MAKERS ARGUE AND MAKE THE DECISION. THE POLICY MAKERS IN KANSAS CITY HAVE ALREADY...
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| 00:19:29 |
Host, -
CERTAINLY THERE WERE MANY PEOPLE WHO WERE NOT ELIGIBLE FOR MILITIA DUTY OR NOT SUBJECT TO MILITIA SERVICE WHO, NEVERTHELESS, WERE EXPECTED TO OFTENTIMES...
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| 00:19:49 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
FIRST. IT'S NOT AT ALL UNCOMMON FOR A LEGISLATIVE PROVISION OR A CONSTITUTIONAL PROVISION TO GO FURTHER THAN IS NECESSARY FOR THE PRINCIPLE PURPOSE...
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| 00:20:05 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
MILITIA. BUT, THE SECOND CLAUSE GOES BEYOND THE MILITIA AND SAYS THE RIGHT OF THE PEOPLE TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS. NOW, YOU MAY SAY THE KIND OF ARMS...
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| 00:20:44 |
Host, -
FREEDOM. WE --
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| 00:20:46 |
Caller, -
AND THEY'RE NOT HAVING THE SAME FREEDOM HERE. TWO, LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICERS CANNOT INTERVENE UNTIL A LAW HAS BEEN BROKEN. THAT MEANS, YOU ARE ON YOUR...
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| 00:21:26 |
Host, -
OF GUN, THAT, I
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| 00:21:27 |
Guest, -
THINK MAKES A LESS CIVIL SOCIETY, LESS SAFE SOCIETY. AGAIN I MADE THE POINT EARLIER GENERALLY THE MORE GUNS YOU HAVE IN A HOME, A CITY, STATE, COUNTRY,...
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| 00:23:01 |
Host, -
UP. WHY DON'T WE GO BACK TO THE TEXT. AND THAT'S WHEN IT WAS INTERJECTED. THE RIGHT
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| 00:23:06 |
Guest, -
WILL NOT BE INFRINGED. DOES THIS OR NOT WHETHER WE TALK REASONABLENESS STANDARDS OR SKRIKT SCRUTINY OR WHATEVER WHY DON'T WE CONSIDER DOES A HANDGUN...
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| 00:25:21 |
Guest, -
IN, TO GET THE LOADED GUN AND MAKE SURE YOU ARE HITTING A BAD GUY AND NOT A BROTHER-IN-LAW WHO CAME TO VISIT DURING THE NIGHT. >> Host: WE'LL GET...
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| 00:25:52 |
Host, -
KNOB AND 3, 22, 95 -- IS IT
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| 00:25:59 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
LIKE THAT, A NUMERICAL CODE? YOU TURN ON THE LAMP AND PICK UP YOUR READING GLASSES -- [ LAUGHTER ] >> Host: NEXT CALL, WASHTS,
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| 00:26:11 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
D.C. >> Caller: GOOD MORNING. >> Host: MORNING. >> Caller: THANK YOU FOR TAKING MY CALL. I LIVE IN THE DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA AND I BELIEVE THAT MOST...
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| 00:26:31 |
Caller, -
IS, WHY
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| 00:26:32 |
Host, -
SHOULD
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| 00:26:33 |
Caller, -
WE, AS -- AND OUR POLITICAL REPRESENTATIVES IN THE DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA NOT HAVE THE RIGHT TO MAKE LAWS THAT WE FEEL, WE BELIEVE WILL BE BEST FOR OUR...
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| 00:27:57 |
Guest, -
ON THE RIGHT TO FREE SPEECH OR THE
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| 00:27:59 |
Guest, -
RIGHT TO ASSEMBLE. BY THE SAME TOKEN, PEOPLE HAVE RIGHT TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS, EVEN IF IT IS NOT THE MAJORITY WHO WANTS TO EXERCISE THAT RIGHT. SHOE...
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| 00:29:14 |
Guest, -
ALL THESE PUBLIC PLACES. SHE INDICATED THAT THE POLICE CHIEF IN D.C. THAT SHE HAD TO TURN HER GUN IN YESTERDAY WHEN -- EVEN THOUGH SHE'S THE POLICE...
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| 00:30:14 |
Host, -
AND STEVEN STEPHEN HALBROOK A MEMBER OF THE NATIONAL RIFLE ASSOCIATION. DAIRY, NEW HAMPSHIRE, GOOD MORNING. GO AHEAD. >> Caller: YES, GOOD MORNING. GOOD...
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| 00:30:41 |
Caller, -
SAD THAT WE HAVE TAKEN AND CHIPPED AWAY AT THESE AMENDMENT RIGHTS AND WE HAVE ACTIVIST JUDGES ON THE COURT AND SOME COMMENTS MADE THAT WERE DISTURBING....
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| 00:31:48 |
Host, -
IN POLLS SHOW THAT CLOSE TO 75%
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| 00:31:50 |
Guest, -
BELIEVE IT'S AN INDIVIDUAL RIGHT, MOST POLITICIANS BELIEVE THAT. HOWEVER, ALSO, THOSE SAME POLLS SHOW MAYBE 60% BELIEVE A HANDGUN BAN MAKES SENSE....
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| 00:33:01 |
Host, -
YOU KNOW, MOST ARMS WERE LONG RIFLES AND, YOU KNOW,
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| 00:33:07 |
Caller, -
PERSONAL
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| 00:33:08 |
Host, -
PISTOLS. TODAY, IT'S
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| 00:33:10 |
Caller, -
A WHOLE DIFFERENT DEFINITION, IN MY OPINION. SECOND, THE DEFINITION OF AN EXPLOSIVE, WHICH IS CONTROLLED. A BULLET IS NOTHING MORE THAN A SMALL PIPE...
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| 00:34:08 |
Host, -
SYSTEM THAT BECAME PART
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| 00:34:09 |
Guest, -
OF THE BRADY ACT BUT ON THE OTHER HAND WE WANT TO HAVE THE AVAILABILITY, THE FREEDOM OF CHOICE OF PERSONS TO OWN GUNS IF THEY ARE LAW-ABIDING AND DON'T...
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| 00:35:58 |
Host, -
TRY TO PREVENT THAT BACKGROUND CHECKING FOR PEOPLE TO GET THOSE HANDGUNS. THERE WAS A DISCUSSION YESTERDAY ABOUT ARMS THAT WAS VERY INTERESTING. ONE...
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| 00:37:09 |
Host, -
A TOTAL BAN ON POSSESSION IS THAT IT'S A BAN ONLY ON THE POSSESSION OF ONE KIND OF WEAPON, OF HANDGUNS THAT'S BEEN CONSIDERED ESPECIALLY -- ESPECIALLY...
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| 00:37:23 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
PROHIBITS THE POSSESSION OF BOOKS, IT'S ALL RIGHT YOU IF ALLOW THE POSSESSION OF NEWSPAPERS? >> NO, IT'S
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| 00:37:29 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
NOT. AND THE DIFFERENCE IS QUITE CLEAR. IF -- IF -- IF YOU -- THERE'S NO LIMIT TO THE PUBLIC DISCOURSE. THAT IF THERE'S AN INDIVIDUAL RIGHT FOR PERSONAL...
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| 00:37:42 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
CARRY OUT A PURPOSE LIKE PROTECTING A HOME, YOU COULD NOT, FOR EXAMPLE, SAY, THAT NO ONE MAY HAVE MORE THAN 50 BOOKS.
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| 00:37:49 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
BUT, A LAW THAT SAID NO ONE MAY POSSESS MORE THAN 50 GUNS WOULD, IN FACT, BE, I THINK, THE -- >> THE REGULATION AT ISSUE HERE IS NOT ONE THAT GOES TO...
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| 00:38:17 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
RIFLES AND HANDGUNS ARE NOT FULLY SATISFACTORY TO CARRY OUT THE PURPOSES -- >> Host: NEXT CALL, WASHINGTON, D.C. >> Caller: HELLO, GOOD MORNING? >> Host:...
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| 00:38:34 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
ABLE TO GET THROUGH. I'VE BEEN ENJOYING THIS CONVERSATION AND I LISTENED TO THE DELIBERATIONS YESTERDAY WITH THE --
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| 00:38:44 |
Host, -
A GREAT DEAL OF
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| 00:38:46 |
Caller, -
INTEREST. AND AS I'VE BEEN
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| 00:38:47 |
Host, -
LISTENING TO THE WORDS THAT WE'VE BEEN
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| 00:38:49 |
Caller, -
USING, THAT I'VE HEARD USED IN BOTH THE DELIBERATIONS AND IN THIS CONVERSATION THIS MORNING, I WAS STRUCK BY THIS MAY SEEM LIKE IT'S TANGENTIAL...
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| 00:40:15 |
Guest, -
ABOUT 1979. THEY ARE A SPECIAL RESTRICTION THAT APPLIED TO THEM. OF COURSE, BACK IN THE DAYS OF THE FOUNDING, THERE WAS DISCRIMINATION AGAINST INDIANS...
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| 00:41:25 |
Guest, -
RESTRICTS CARRYING YOUR GUN IN THE MARKETPLACE. SO, THE CHALLENGE FOR THE COURT HERE IS HOW TO TAKE THE LANGUAGE WRITTEN IN 1790, 1791 AND COLORED...
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| 00:42:10 |
Host, -
RAILROAD TRACTION. MY HUSBAND WENT TO
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| 00:42:12 |
Caller, -
THE LOCAL GUN STORE AND BOUGHT A PISTOL AND TAUGHT ME HOW TO RESPONSE' USE IT AND I FELT SAFE IN OUR LITTLE HOME. THE CRIMINAL CULTURE NOW IS WORSE...
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| 00:42:57 |
Host, -
POOR POPULATION, THE POLICE DON'T
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| 00:42:59 |
Guest, -
GIVE THEM VERY MUCH PROTECTION AND I THINK EVERYTHING THE LADY SAID ABOUT HER EXPERIENCE APPLIES TO A NUMBER OF PEOPLE HERE IN THE DISTRICT. >> Guest:...
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| 00:43:28 |
Guest, -
PRO-MARKMANSHIP BADGE AND GOING TO YMCA CAMP, I'M FAMILIAR WITH GUNS AND NOT ANTIGUNS. WE MAKE IT TOO EASY IN THIS COUNTRY FOR DANGEROUS PEOPLE TO ...
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| 00:44:25 |
Host, -
BELIEVE THAT THEY HAD IN MIND DEFENDING OURSELF AGAINST A GOVERNMENT THAT WAS OVERBEARING OR GOT OUT OF HAND. AND I THINK
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| 00:44:33 |
Caller, -
THAT'S PRECISELY WHAT THEY
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| 00:44:34 |
Guest, -
HAD IN
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| 00:44:35 |
Caller, -
MIND. THAT THEY DID INTEND FOR THAT. I MEAN, RIGHT NOW, WE ARE STILL RELATIVELY A FREE SOCIETY. BUT, EVERY DAY, OUR FREEDOMS ARE CHIPPED AWAY AT. AND...
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| 00:45:33 |
Guest, -
A RABAL OR MOB. IT WAS ORGANIZED. IF YOU TAKE THE ARGUMENTS SOMETIMES MADE TO THEIR EXTREME YOU OFTEN END WITH SITUATIONS LIKE IN KIRKWOOD, MISSOURI....
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| 00:46:19 |
Host, -
AND NOTHING YOU COULD DO WOULD HELP AND BEING
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| 00:46:21 |
Guest, -
ENACTED BY THE CONTINENTAL NENL CONGRESS IT WAS A COMMUNITY DECISION TO TAKE UP AGAINST ARMS ALREADY USED. THE BRITISH CROWN BECAME AN ILLEGAL GOVERNMENT,...
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| 00:47:16 |
Host, -
VERMONT, DID REFER TO SELF-DEFENSE AS A PERMISSIBLE JUSTIFICATION AND ALL OF THE OTHERS REFERRED TO COMMON DEFENSE OR DEFENSE OF THE STATES? AND IN...
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| 00:47:31 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
TO SELF-DEFENSE? >> YOUR HONOR, THE STATE COURTS INTERPRETING THOSE THAT YOU REFERENCE HAD A DIFFERENT INTERPRETATION. FOR EXAMPLE IN 1895. >> I'M...
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| 00:47:56 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
SELF-DEFENSE. THE REST, REFER TO ONLY COMMON DEFENSE. IS THAT NOT CORRECT? >> ON THEIR LITERAL TEXT, YES, BUT JUDGES NOW INTERPRET THEM THAT WAY. FOR...
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| 00:48:06 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
I UNDERSTAND THE JUDICIAL INTERPRETATION SOMETIMES IS CONTROLLING
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| 00:48:09 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
AND SOMETIMES IS NOT. BUT THE TEXT ITSELF DOES DRAW A
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| 00:48:12 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
DISTINCTION JUST AS THE SECOND AMENDMENT DOES, IT DOESN'T MENTION SELF-DEFENSE. >> Host: THAT WAS JUSTICE STEVENS. MR. HELMKE? >>
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| 00:48:21 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
Guest: HE MADE A VERY GOOD POINT AND ACTUALLY YOU CAN MAKE AN ARGUMENT NOT EVEN THE TWO STATE CONSTITUTIONS PROVIDED FOR THE RIGHT OF
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| 00:48:27 |
Unidentified Speaker, -
SELF-DEFENSE, DEPENDS HOW YOU READ THOSE. BUT MADE THE POINT IF THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT WANTED TO PUT IN A RIGHT TO SELF-DEFENSE THEY CLEARLY COULD...
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| 00:48:38 |
Host, -
EITHER. SO THAT THE WHOLE IDEA IS THAT THE SECOND AMENDMENT
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| 00:48:41 |
Guest, -
DEALT WITH THE MILITIA PURPOSE. THE COUNTERBALANCE AGAINST THE FEDERAL FEDERAL GOVERNMENT. >> Guest: THIS WAS ONE OF MY FAVORITE PARTS YESTERDAY BECAUSE...
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| 00:49:09 |
Guest, -
IN THE CASE OF NORTH CAROLINA THAT THE PEOPLE HAVE A RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS IN DEFENSE OF THE STATE, STILL AN INDIVIDUAL RIGHT, STILL REFERRING TO THE RIGHT...
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| 00:50:04 |
Host, -
REALISTICALLY, HANDGUNS ARE
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| 00:50:05 |
Caller, -
GAY. GET A TOMAHAWK OR HATCHET OR SOMETHING, A SLINGSHOT. >> Host: MR. HALBROOK. >> Guest: I ASSUME THAT'S A REFERENCE TO THE NAME THE NATIONAL RIFLE...
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| 00:50:30 |
Host, -
WAR. IT'S THE NAME, YOU COULD CALL
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| 00:50:32 |
Guest, -
IT THE NATIONAL SHOTGUN ASSOCIATION HAD IT BEEN STARTED BY PEOPLE IN TRAP AND SKEET. THE NRA SUPPORTS THE SECOND AMENDMENT AND OTHER PARTS OF THE CONSTITUTION...
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| 00:51:16 |
Guest, -
CAN'T REGULATE ON SOME THINGS, WHAT COMES OFF THE TABLE AND WHAT HAPPENS IN OUR COMMUNITY IN. >> Host: ARE THOSE CHALLENGES FOR THE STATES OR DOES...
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| 00:51:40 |
Host, -
FROM KANSAS CITY, YOU MIGHT HAVE A CHANGE AT THE FEDERAL LEVEL BUT YOU'VE GOT OTHER ARGUMENTS IN
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| 00:51:45 |
Guest, -
DIFFERENT STATES AND REALLY AS ONE OF THE JUSTICES POINTED OUT YESTERDAY, YOU COULD HAVE DIFFERENT RULES IN WYOMING OR MAKE -- IT IS LOGICAL TO...
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| 00:52:22 |
Host, -
THEM. YOU KNOW, THEY COULD JUST HAVE EASILY HAVE SAID WE'LL BAN ALL RIFLES AND YOU CAN HAVE A
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| 00:52:28 |
Caller, -
HANDGUN IN YOUR HOME OR ALL SHOTGUNS AND YOU CAN HAVE A HANDGUN AND A RIFLE, OR WHATEVER. BUT THEY'RE TRYING TO GET AROUND THE VERY POINT OR ASPECT...
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| 00:53:05 |
Host, -
BAN THE SECOND
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| 00:53:06 |
Guest, -
ONE AND ALLOW THE FIRST ONE. HOW DO YOU DISTINGUISH AND IS IT ARBITRARY? SO, I THINK THE FUNDAMENTAL POINT IS WE'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT AND NOBODY'S...
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| 00:54:33 |
Guest, -
HANDGUNS MIGHT NOT BE ALLOWED BUT A BAN FROM THE MACHINE GUNS FROM THE 1930s AND THE PROHIBITION ERA IS ALLOWED. IF THE JUSTICES ARE DRAWING TOES LINES,...
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NOTE: The transcript for this program was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.