Thank you, Chairman.

Chairman Royce, Ranking Member Sherman, and Distinguished

Members of the Committee. On behalf of the Command Staff,...

What has occurred here within the San Diego Sec-

tor area of responsibility, it’s not so much where there’s a separa-

tion between a...

Specific just to the San Diego Sector area responsi-

bility, Chairman, this current fiscal year, we have apprehended

roughly 108,000 illegal...

180,000 roughly through fiscal year, year to date.

Of that total, approximately 900 are what we consider OTMs. Their

origin or their place...

Yes.

Yes, sir, we would be.

Yes, sir.

That can be an occurrence, yes, sir.

That would be a correct assumption, yes, sir.

Yes, sir.

With respect to those exact figures, I would have

to get back to you on that. But I would like to respond——

Let me respond, at any time that we design and

implement an operational plan to gain control of a specific target

area within our area of...

Please.

One thousand, three hundred and twenty-four prosecutions,

which is alien smuggling prosecutions, have remained relatively

constant,...

In San Diego Sector, if I could just mention, our

one need, or you could say vulnerability, is a lack of a complete de-

tection of technology...

Yes, sir.

It’s the three principles of any operational plan:

Personnel, technology, and tactical infrastructure. And I know each

and every one—I...

Yes, sir. And the use will be called ‘‘Human Moni-

toring System.’’

Governor Schwarzenegger has deployed roughly, or

will be deploying, roughly 1,000 California guard troops to the Cali-

fornia border in...

I believe we have their commitment through the

end of 2008, December.

Yes, sir.

Yes. To me, the foot soldiers in this effort to gain

control of our nation’s border, an important component in this are

the foot guides....

I would just suggest the consideration that the

guidelines are a little bit more standardized across the border so

it doesn’t allow our...

Yes, sir.

Very much so.

I support your statement there.

International border is just that. It’s a shared border. And both

countries, in this case United States...

Thank you.

Mr. Rohrabacher.

Thank you very much.

No, but it sure would be a step in the right direc-

tion.

With respect to civilian law enforcement agencies,

and I’ll be specific here to San Diego, removed from the border

area, if they were...

If there’s nothing to validate a deportation pro-

ceeding or criminal proceeding, then yes.

Actually, that’s within the jurisdiction of the Immi-

gration and Customs enforcement and not the under the direction

of the CBP so I...

We could certainly speak on behalf of special

agents in charge of the ICE office here. They certainly, as us,

would welcome additional research...

Let me assure you, we are advancing for it in our

efforts here within the San Diego Sector.

With respect to developing a multidiscipline...

Our operations is Budget Performance Plan Ap-

proach. We identify exactly what we need, both in officer core and

mission support, and it...

This year, factoring in attrition, we’ll roughly bring

in 200 new Border Patrol agents here in the San Diego Sector.

There will be more...

Yes, it does, very much. Especially—and I’ll just

limit my comments to San Diego-specific.

As you alluded to earlier, during the 1980s,...

Yes, if you’re referencing informal deportations, a

voluntary return back to their country of origin,

Yes, the overwhelming majority of people that we

apprehend request voluntary return back to their country of origin

which we then provide.

A prior criminal conviction or an extensive vol-

untary return history would qualify them for deportation pro-

ceedings.

I do not have that information right now, but I cer-

tainly would give that to you——

Yes.

Aggravated felons do not get voluntarily returned,

I assure you that.

One issue, if we wanted to detain and set up more people for for-

mal...

[Nods.]

It’s a very good question.

And it’s caused a considerable, considerable debate.

Responsibility away from the border, and I don’t want to hand

this off, but that...

As the chief of the sector, so you’re talking to the

commander, if we can respond to address the situation, we will.

But please understand,...

It costs the county taxpayers about $80 million a year

to incarcerate illegal immigrants. Our reimbursement last year was

$11 million.

It’s part of the National Sheriffs’ policy that full

reimbursement occur.

We went up from $9 million down to $2.3 mil-

lion.

May I say one thing here?

When a county has to spend $80 million for illegal immigrant

costs in jail, the Federal Government does not help...

I disagree.

You want me to elaborate?

First of all, and I welcome any of you to come to our

neck of the woods, you will see first hand that we are having gun-

fights lasting...

Mr. Sherman, when you’ve got 37 defectors of the

Mexican military who are trained in Fort Benning, Georgia by us

to go and fight narco-terrorism...

No.

No.

No.

I would agree with that logic on the first offense.

But a study in the L.A. County Sheriff’s system showed that a

5-year period, 70 percent...

It should be a Federal offense in all cases, as it is with

just reentering, if you did commit a crime.

And it may be important to point...

Yes.

There goes some votes.

If you commit a felony, they would go to Federal

prison.

You don’t have the resources to do it.

I’ll answer the same.

Going northbound, about 6,000–7,000 on a daily

basis.

It’s very difficult for U.S. Customs Inspectors to in-

spect every truck. And of course, there’s always diversions, because

they’ll...

Well, as soon as the sun goes down, you hear the

gunshots and the automatic weapons going off, 50-caliber weapons.

This is the kind of weaponry...

If the price is right, it works.

Well, Mr. Poe, for me to fly from San Antonio to

Houston and have an air marshal sitting next to me, and then we

got together and we started...

It’s probably already happened.

I’m not sure I understand.

I would like to see the Federal Government do that first part—

what was the first part?

You know, this is the question, obviously, between the

House and the Senate’s version of the two particular important so-

lutions.

What...

This is the hard fact of the problem that you’re grap-

pling with. I don’t care if I’m reelected or not, so anybody who

wants to say...

But this is not an issue that can be easily dealt with

with a simple solution. We don’t have enough prisons in America

or enough local...

In Los Angeles County, the total prosecutorial and in-

carceration costs annually to the taxpayers are $200 million.

$11 million.

Every year, the National Sheriffs’ Association agency,

the major city chiefs of police, and the County of Los Angeles, be-

cause we have...

I can say for the State of Texas we received—last

year they received $137 million. Out of $137 million, we probably

got less than a third....

I’m not sure I know the answer to all the ques-

tions.

But we certainly work well with the Federal Government and we

have a Joint...

We do need more SCAAP money. I think the rest

it is—we are, from an intelligence perspective, I think we’re doing

pretty well.

Keep...

Madam Congresswoman——

Pretty much the support in terms of resources. It’s

very difficult for us to perform our jobs when we’re limited in re-

sources.

The...

It’s got to be well over 100.

They were killed. [Referring to Mexican police of-

ficers.]

Yes.

Yes. We do.

In Texas, our asset forfeitures, we take 80 percent

and the State takes 20 percent.

If you ask me, I wish we would take 100 percent. Okay?...

Yes, that happens.

Both ways being back.

That only occurs, Congresswoman, when the U.S. At-

torney’s office presents a case to the Federal court. And that’s our

issue earlier...

Absolutely.

Funding is the critical answer to all these major problems, be-

cause this is a growth industry. The minute the Federal Govern-

ment...

We have 10 million people residing in L.A. County.

That’s correct.

Mr. Chairman, Members of the Subcommittee and

other Members of Congress, thank you for the opportunity to dis-

cuss our undercover opportunity...

Chairman Royce, Ranking Member Sherman, Mem-

bers of the Subcommittee and Congress. Thank you for the invita-

tion to hear the concerns...

In 2002, the Department of Justice—Office of Legal

Counsel concluded that State and local police have inherent

unpreempted authority to...

Good morning—or afternoon, Mr. Chairman, Mem-

bers of the Committee, including Ranking Member Sherman.

I am Andy Ramirez, chairman of...

Yeah I could highlight a couple of things. One is

the terrorist threat posed by overland crossings. We knew after

9/11 as we in the Justice...

As you might imagine, it has a very demoralizing

effect when you go out and risk your life enforcing the immigration

laws of the United...

We certainly believe that. But they don’t expect

very much anymore because of what goes on, what they experience

every day.

No. We trust their government as far as we trust

any other terrorist country.

‘‘Back.’’

Can I just make one response?

With respect to rushing to committee, this is the Senate bill, it’s

800 pages. That’s double-sided. I’m...

I work in Missouri and live in Kansas.

Yes. Let me pull my notes up on that, sir, because

this is rather detailed and intricate, but I’ll try to be as brief as

possible.

With...

Yes, sir.

That is correct.

I’ve been on the Canadian border for the past 11 days, engaging

in meetings on the northern sector, as well as a lot...

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Let me ask a quick question, see if I can get a yes or no to this.

Previously we talked to the panelists and the...

Clearly, there are areas where they’re not getting

adequate funding.

Clearly, Canada needs more resources as well. But

remember, the Millennium Bomber came through a port of entry.

We have documented cases...

I agree that Canada needs more resources, but we

shouldn’t pretend that somehow the southern border is locked up

without the necessary...

I think there’s a lot of merit to that suggestion. I

think it’s probably—you said one document such as a passport?

You’re talking about the northern border, then?

Well, clearly on the northern border one of the

problems is that you can get across just by asserting that you’re

a U.S. citizen. And...

Sure. It would also help local police if they knew

what to look for. But the State and local police also have a 24–7

phone line if they’re...

As you’re very well aware, the Homeland Security

Act stripped away many of those rights and protections. The U.S.

Courts of Appeals for...

Requirement to build a wall?

Well, hasn’t Sheriff Joe proved, if you have a deterrence, and I’m

referring to Sheriff Joe Arpaio, if...

Not concentration camps—we’re not talking con-

centration camps.

That was a cheap shot.