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| TIME | SPEAKER | TEXT |
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| 00:00:09 |
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WASHINGTON JOURNAL IS LIVE EVERY DAY AT 7:00 A.M. EASTERN. WE'RE LEAVING THIS NOW FOR SAME DAY ORAL... |
| 00:00:38 |
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WE WILL HEAR ARGUMENT THIS MORNING IN CASE 08-322, NORTHWEST AUSTIN MUNICIPAL UTILITY DISTRICT DIVORCE... |
| 00:00:45 |
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GOOD MORNING, MR. CHIEF JUSTICE. AND MAY IT PLEASE THE COURT, AFTER MORE THAN 20 YEARS OF STEADFAST... |
| 00:01:23 |
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IT MAY BE A POLITICAL SUBDIVISION UNDER THOSE DECISIONS, BUT IT IS CERTAINLY NOT POLITICAL SUBDIVISION... |
| 00:01:30 |
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WELL, WE DISAGREE WITH THAT, YOUR HONOR. WE BELIEVE THAT UNDER DOHERTY COUNTY IN PARTICULAR THE COURT... |
| 00:01:45 |
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BAILOUT WASN'T INVOLVED IN THOSE CASES. AND WHAT DO YOU DO WITH THE STATUTE THAT HAS THREE CATEGORIES,... |
| 00:02:17 |
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JUSTICE GINSBURG, THE TERM GOVERNMENTAL UNIT DOESN'T ACTUALLY APPEAR IN THE PROVISION THAT AUTHORIZES... |
| 00:02:54 |
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BUT THE STATUTE DOES USE THE TERM GOVERNMENTAL UNIT TO ENCOMPASS DISTRICTS. AND IF THEY WERE ALSO... |
| 00:03:07 |
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AGAIN, I DISAGREE WITH YOUR HONER THAT THE TERM GOVERNMENTAL UNIATE PEERS IN THE PROVISION THAT --... |
| 00:03:14 |
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IT APPEARS IN THE STATUTE TWICE, SUGGESTING THAT CONGRESS HAS IN MIND THREE CATEGORIES. |
| 00:03:22 |
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AGAIN, THE STATUTE DEFINES WHO IS ELIGIBLE TO BAIL OUT SAYS A STATE, A POLITICAL SUBDIVISION THAT... |
| 00:04:29 |
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IN THE EXTENT THAT WE HAVE SOME LATITUDE IN CONSTRUING THE ACT, CERTAINLY IT WOULD BE A RELEVANT FACTOR... |
| 00:05:03 |
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WELL, CERTAINLY WE BELIEVE THAT THE PURPOSES OF THE ACT SUGGEST THAT WE SHOULD BE CONSIDERED POLITICAL... |
| 00:06:06 |
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IF YOUR DISTRICT WERE LOCATED IN A SEPARATELY COVERED POLITICAL SUBDIVISION, YOU CLEARLY COULD NOT... |
| 00:06:14 |
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WELL, I AGAIN, COURT DOESN'T NEED TO REACH THAT QUESTION NOW. BUT I'M NOT SURE THAT THE ANSWERS THAT... |
| 00:07:06 |
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IT WAS THE DISTRICT COURT HAD SOME ASSISTANCE FROM THE LEGISLATIVE DEVELOPMENT OF THIS LATEST EXTENSION.... |
| 00:07:27 |
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I DON'T KNOW THAT THERE WAS A SPECIFIC LEGISLATIVE PROPOSAL, JUSTICE GINSBURG. THERE WAS CERTAINLY... |
| 00:07:36 |
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WHAT WAS THE REASON THAT IT WAS RESISTED? |
| 00:07:40 |
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I DON'T KNOW THAT THE RECORD ACTUALLY SHOWS THAT IT WAS RESISTED. IT WAS SIMPLY PART OF THE DISCUSSION... |
| 00:08:49 |
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THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE HAS -- DOES IT NOT HAVE A REGULATION THAT CONTRADICTS YOUR READING? AND... |
| 00:09:07 |
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YES, JUSTICE GINSBURG. BUT UNLIKE THE ATTORNEY GENERAL'S REGULATIONS THAT RELATE TO PRECLEARANCE,... |
| 00:09:40 |
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IF WE FIND THAT YOU'RE NOT COVERED BY THE BAILOUT PROVISION, THAT ONLY THE COUNTY IS, DO YOU REALLY... |
| 00:10:05 |
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WELL, WITH RESPECT TO OUR CONSTITUTIONALITY ISSUE, JUSTICE KENNEDY, ONE THING NOBODY IS CONTESTING... |
| 00:10:28 |
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AS PRECLEARANCE HAS BEEN DENIED TO YOU? |
| 00:10:30 |
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WELL, WE DIDN'T SEEK A PRECLEARANCE -- |
| 00:10:33 |
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EXACTLY. IF YOU'RE BASING IT SIMPLY ON YOUR SUBJECTION TO PRECLEARANCE, AND THERE IS NO CONTEST BETWEEN... |
| 00:10:44 |
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WELL, THERE IS CERTAINLY A POSSIBILITY WE MAY SEEK TO PRECLEAR THINGS IN THE FUTURE, BUT THIS -- |
| 00:10:48 |
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ISN'T THAT THE TIME TO LITIGATE IT? |
| 00:10:51 |
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NO, JUSTICE SOUTER. THIS IS PRIMARILY A FACIAL CHALLENGE TO THE STATUTE. WE ARE SUBJECT TO THE OBLIGATIONS... |
| 00:10:59 |
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IT IS NOT AFFECTING ANYTHING YOU'RE DOING ON A DAY TO DAY BASIS, AS I UNDERSTAND IT. THERE IS NO CLAIM... |
| 00:11:25 |
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I AGREE -- I DISAGREE WITH THAT AS WELL, JUSTICE SOUTER. WHILE IT HAS NOT BEEN HIGHLIGHTED IN THE... |
| 00:11:44 |
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WHAT WAS THE LAST TIME THAT THE DISTRICT APPLIED FOR PRECLEARANCE THE LAST YEAR? |
| 00:11:54 |
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THE CONTRACT IN 2004 BY WHICH WE ASKED THE COUNTY TO ACTUALLY PERFORM THE ELECTION ITSELF THAT WAS... |
| 00:12:02 |
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AND SO 2004 IS THE LAST YEAR, SO BETWEEN 2004 AND 2009 THE DISTRICT HAS NOT SOUGHT PRECLEARANCE. |
| 00:12:09 |
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THAT'S CORRECT. THIS LAW -- |
| 00:12:11 |
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YOU'RE SUBJECT TO PRECLEARANCE AND YOU CANNOT MAKE CHANGES WITHOUT GOING TO THE ATTORNEY GENERAL AND... |
| 00:12:18 |
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THAT'S CORRECT. |
| 00:12:23 |
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IS IT ANY DIFFERENT FROM A FEDERAL LAW PROHIBITING A CERTAIN A SPEECH? DO YOU HAVE TO SUBJECT YOURSELF... |
| 00:12:39 |
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NO, JUSTICE. |
| 00:12:41 |
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CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, AND I MAY BE WRONG ON THIS, I THOUGHT THIS SUIT E VENN FROM THE FACT THAT... |
| 00:13:11 |
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I DO THINK YOU'RE WRONG ABOUT THAT, JUSTICE SUITOR. THE SUIT SOUGHT BAILOUT. THE LAWSUIT SEEKS THE... |
| 00:13:28 |
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YOU SEPARATELY ASKED FOR |
| 00:13:30 |
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YES. |
| 00:13:31 |
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IF YOU HAVE BAILOUTS AND WE ACCEPT YOUR READING OF THIS STATUTE, YOU ARE NOT CONTESTING THE CONSTITUTIONALITY... |
| 00:13:50 |
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WE CERTAINLY CONTEST AND CONTEND THAT PRECLEARANCE THE UNCONSTITUTIONAL. WE ACKNOWLEDGE THAT IF THE... |
| 00:14:07 |
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I THOUGHT I JUST HEARD YOU SAY, EVEN IF YOU GOT THE BAILOUT THE EXTENSION FOR ANOTHER 25 YEARS WOULD... |
| 00:14:33 |
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WE DO NOT SAY THAT THE MODIFICATION WOULD MAKE THE STATUTE UNCONSTITUTIONAL. YOUR POSITION IS BOLD... |
| 00:14:55 |
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DO YOU ACKNOWLEDGE THAT IF WE FIND ON YOUR FAVOR, WE MAY NOT REACH THAT POINT? YOU WOULDN'T BE SUBJECT... |
| 00:15:05 |
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RIGHT, BUT BECAUSE WE DREW UP THE CLAIMS IN ONE LAWSUIT, WE HAD TO ASSERT THEM IN ONE LEVEL. GETS... |
| 00:15:41 |
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MR. COLEMAN, MAY I RAISE A BASIC POINT HERE? I WANT TO START WITH IT. YOUR ARGUMENT IS LARGELY BASED... |
| 00:17:15 |
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OUR ANSWER IS A VERY CLEAR ONE IN THAT THERE IS A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A NON-DISCRIMINATION STATUTE... |
| 00:17:49 |
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THE EVIDENCE I'VE GOTTEN INTO IS A PRETTY GOOD INDICATION THAT THERE IS SOMETHING TO BE CONCERNED... |
| 00:18:14 |
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BUT THERE WAS, CONGRESS ON THAT ISSUE AND IT REFERRED TO SECOND GENERATION DISCRIMINATION, WHICH IS... |
| 00:18:57 |
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THE COURT RECOGNIZED THAT CONGRESS HAS BEEN TRYING FOR SEVERAL YEARS TO FIX THIS PROBLEM AND IT'S... |
| 00:19:44 |
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I'D LIKE TO HEAR YOUR ANSWER. |
| 00:19:45 |
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NOTWITHSTANDING THAT RECORD, IT IS NOT THE KIND OF RECORD. CONGRESS PUT TOGETHER WHAT IT BELIEVES... |
| 00:20:12 |
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TAKE THE ONE, AS SIMPLE AS MOVING THE ELECTION DAY SO THAT IT WILL COINCIDE WITH THE HOLIDAY OF A... |
| 00:20:43 |
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TWO POINTS ON THAT. FIRST, WITH RESPECT TO THE WALLER COUNTY ISSUE, THAT WAS VERY SWIFTLY ADDRESSED... |
| 00:21:04 |
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PERHAPS THEY WOULDN'T IF THE ONLY TWO IN THE ARSONAL WERE SECTION TWO. EVERYTHING HAS TO BE A FEDERAL... |
| 00:21:12 |
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FOR THE SECOND, PLEASE. JUST TAKE TWO MINUTES TO ANSWER IT OR NOT. YOU DON'T HAVE TO. BUT IT SEEMS... |
| 00:22:44 |
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I'M NOT GOING TO HAVE TIME TO RESPOND TO ALL OF THAT, BUT WITH RESPECT TO THE FIRST POINT, VOTER REGISTRATION... |
| 00:24:15 |
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DID REFER YOU TO SOME OTHER MORE CURRENT STATISTICS SUBMISSIONS. YOU MIGHT WANT TO ADDRESS THOSE. ... |
| 00:25:02 |
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THE DATA WAS OF TWO KINDS. THERE WAS SOME DATA THAT GROUPED ALL COVERED JURISDICTIONS INTO ONE LUMP... |
| 00:26:05 |
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WHAT COVERAGE FORMULA WOULD BE ADEQUATE? YOU ARE ATTACKING CONGRESS'S PRESERVATION OF THE FORMULA,... |
| 00:26:20 |
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ONE EXAMPLE, AND I'M NOT RECOMMENDING THIS, BUT IF FOR INSTANCE, THE SAME FORMULA HAD BEEN APPLIED... |
| 00:26:48 |
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THERE WAS, MAYBE THE GOVERNMENT WILL REFER TO IT, I THOUGHT QUITE A BIT OF EVIDENCE COMPARING COVERED... |
| 00:27:03 |
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I WOULDN'T SAY QUITE A BIT. IT LUMPED ALL COVERED JURISDICTION AND NON-COVERED. |
| 00:27:08 |
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YOU SAID A NUMBER OF SECTION TWO SUITS, WHICH I THINK IS QUITE A BIT MORE THAN THAT. |
| 00:27:15 |
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I DISPUTE THAT. IT'S NOT THAT INFORMATION. AGAIN, IT DOESN'T TAKE INTO ACCOUNT ANY ATTEMPT TO SAY... |
| 00:27:43 |
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IN YOUR ANSWER, YOU SAID IF THEY USED THE 2004, THE ONLY STATE WOULD BE HAWAII. BUT I ASKED YOU, WHAT... |
| 00:28:13 |
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IT NEEDED TO MAKE AN EVALUATION OF WHERE THERE'S A RISK OF BACKSLIDING AND WHERE THERE IS ACTUAL EVIDENCE... |
| 00:28:23 |
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WHAT ABOUT THE EVIDENCE THAT JUSTICE BRIAR SUMMARIZED, THAT I ALLUDED TO? IT SEEMS TO ME THAT IS RACIAL... |
| 00:28:41 |
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THAT EVIDENCE JUSTIFIES STRICT ENFORCEMENT OF NONDISCRIMINATION STATUTES, BUT DOES NOT JUSTIFY THE... |
| 00:28:59 |
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THEY COULDN'T BE RELIED UPON APPARENTLY, IN SOME CASES IN WHICH THE VOTING WAS WITHDRAWN. |
| 00:29:06 |
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THIS INFORMATION GOES OUT OVER 30 YEARS. |
| 00:29:09 |
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THIS WASN'T INFORMATION OVER 30 YEARS. MY RECOLLECTION, AND I COULD BE WRONG, THOSE WERE STATISTICS... |
| 00:29:26 |
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BUT THE OBJECTION RATE IS ON THE ORDER OF SINGLE DIGITS PER 10,000 SUBMISSIONS. IT'S SIMPLY A MATTER... |
| 00:29:46 |
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THANK YOU, MR. COLEMAN. |
| 00:29:48 |
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THANK YOU, MR. CHIEF JUSTICE AND MAY IT PLEASE THE COURT. LET ME BEGIN WITH MR. COLEMAN LEFT OFF.... |
| 00:30:47 |
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OUR DECISION IN THE CITY OF BER -- HERE, AS I UNDERSTAND IT, 1/20 OF 1% OF THE SUBMISSIONS ARE NOT... |
| 00:31:06 |
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I DISAGREE WITH THAT. I THINK WHAT THAT HE WANTREPRESENTS IS THAT SECTION FIVE IS WORKING VERY WELL.... |
| 00:31:36 |
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IT'S THE ELEPHANT WHISTLE. IF YOU HAVE 99.98% OF THESE BEING PRECLEARED, WHY IS THAT REACHING FAR... |
| 00:31:54 |
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YESTERDAY -- REQUESTS FOR TITLE THREE WIRETAPS IN THE PAST TEN YEARS. FOUR HAD BEEN REJECTED, BY I... |
| 00:32:23 |
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THE PARALLEL ISN'T THERE. THERE ARE LAWS AGAINST INTENTION INTENTIONAL DISCRIMINATION. BUT THE ARGUMENT... |
| 00:32:42 |
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AND CONGRESS FOUND WITH RESPECT TO THOSE INTEN SHL LAWS, THAT THAT IS INEFFECTIVE FOR THE SAME REASONS... |
| 00:32:58 |
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LONG TIME AGO. HOW MUCH OF THE EVIDENCE THAT CONGRESS AMASSED WAS SPECIFICALLY CIRCUMVENTION EVIDENCE?... |
| 00:33:06 |
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QUITE A BIT OF EVIDENCE ABOUT THE INEFFECTIVENESS OF SECTION TWO AS A REMEDY. THE STATEMENT FOR THE... |
| 00:33:38 |
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IF SECTION TWO IS INEFFECTIVE, WHY DIDN'T CONGRESS EXTEND SECTION FIVE TO THE COUNTRY? COULD CONGRESS... |
| 00:34:02 |
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I DON'T BELIEVE SO. THERE ARE FINDINGS THAT SAY THAT SECTION FIVE IS NEEDED IN THESE AREAS. |
| 00:34:09 |
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NOT COMPARATIVE WITH THE REST OF THE COUNTRY EXCEPT IN GROSS. |
| 00:34:15 |
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I DISAGREE WITH THAT FOR SEVERAL REASONS. FIRST OF ALL, AT MOST WHAT THIS UTILITY DISTRICT CAN ARGUE... |
| 00:34:38 |
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18%, THEY REGISTERED -- THESE STATISTICS ARE CORRECT. THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN LATINO AND WHITE REGISTRATION... |
| 00:35:01 |
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AGAIN, I THINK THAT WHAT CONGRESS FOUND IS THAT THE RATE IN TEXAS COUPLED WITH ITS HISTORICAL AMOUNT... |
| 00:35:20 |
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OBVIOUSLY NO ONE DOUBTS THE HISTORY HERE AND THAT IT WAS DIFFERENT, BUT AT WHAT POINT DOES THAT STOP... |
| 00:35:35 |
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I THINK THIS COURT HAS ANSWERED BY SAYING MAYBE THE CASE THAT OTHERS DES CRIMINATE MORE. CONGRESS... |
| 00:35:57 |
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SO YOUR ANSWER IS THAT CONGRESS CAN IMPOSE THIS TREATMENT FOREVER BECAUSE OF THE HISTORY OF THE SOUTH.... |
| 00:36:05 |
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ABSOLUTELY NOT. |
| 00:36:09 |
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WHEN DO THEY HAVE TO STOP? |
| 00:36:11 |
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THEY SAID 25 YEARS WAS THE APPROPRIATE PERIOD. |
| 00:36:13 |
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THEY SAID FIVE YEARS, THEN ANOTHER 20 YEARS. IT BEGINS TO LOOK LIKE THIS IS GOING TO GO ON FOREVER.... |
| 00:36:20 |
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AGAIN, IF CONGRESS CAN'T MAKE THE FINDINGS, THEN I THINK THIS COURT WOULD BE WELL WITHIN ITS POWERS... |
| 00:36:44 |
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IS THE BURDEN THE ACT PUTS ON THE STATE RELEVANT? |
| 00:36:47 |
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IT CERTAINLY IS. |
| 00:36:49 |
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HOW MANY PEOPLE IN THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE, WHAT'S THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE'S FOR PRECLEARANCE... |
| 00:36:59 |
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I DON'T KNOW THE BUDGET. I DON'T KNOW THERE ARE 30 ATTORNEYS. |
| 00:37:03 |
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DO THEY QUAURL WITH A ASSESSMENT THAT COSTS THE STATES AND MUNICIPALITIES $1 BILLION OVER TEN YEARS... |
| 00:37:18 |
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AGAIN, I DON'T QUARREL WITH THAT. |
| 00:37:22 |
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BUT YOU THINK IT'S RELEVANT? |
| 00:37:24 |
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ALSO, THE STATES ARE COMING BEFORE THE COURT AND REJECTIONING -- |
| 00:37:30 |
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THE CONGRESS HAS MADE A FINDING THAT THE SOVEREIGNTY OF GEORGIA IS LESS THAN THE SOVEREIGNTY OF OHIO.... |
| 00:37:57 |
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I WOULDN'T PUT IT AT ALL IN THOSE TERMS. I WOULD SAY THAT CONGRESS FOUND AN HISTORICAL AMOUNT OF DATA... |
| 00:38:13 |
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THEN MY POINT STANDS. YOU SAY THERE'S A BASIS FOR TREATING STATES QUITE DIFFERENTLY AS TO THE FUNDAMENTAL... |
| 00:38:55 |
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IT'S THE SAME AS ITS ALWAYS BEEN -- THE BURDEN IS NOT CONGRESS TO SAY IS CONTINUATION OF THIS LANDMARK... |
| 00:39:19 |
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NO ONE QUESTIONS THE URGENCY OF THE VOTING RIGHTS ACT. THE QUESTION IS WHETHER OR NOT IT SHOULD BE... |
| 00:39:32 |
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AND CONGRESS DID SHOW THAT. THEY SHOWED FOR EXAMPLE THAT THE DIFFERENTIAL BETWEEN COVERED AND NON-COVERED... |
| 00:39:50 |
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WHY DIDN'T CONGRESS THEN EXTEND THE ACT TO MASSACHUSETTS, WHERE AS YOUR BROTHER TOLD US THE DESPAIRTY... |
| 00:40:03 |
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BECAUSE THAT IS ONLY ONE ASPECT OF THE OVERALL PROBLEM. WHAT CONGRESS HAS HISTORICALLY DONE IS TARGET... |
| 00:40:35 |
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WOULD YOU AGREE THERE ARE SOME ODDITIES IN THIS COVERAGE FORMULA? IS IT NOT THE CASE THAT IN NEW YORK... |
| 00:40:52 |
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WHAT THIS COURT HAS SAID IS THAT CONGRESS CAN ACT ON STATE BY STATE LEVEL AND THAT THERE'S A REMEDY... |
| 00:41:03 |
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LET'S TALK ABOUT THE BAILOUT PROVISION. THAT WAS INSERTED IN 1982. |
| 00:41:08 |
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THAT'S CORRECT. |
| 00:41:11 |
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HOW MANY YEARS IS THAT? OVER A QUARTER OF THE CENTURY. THERE HAVE BEEN 15 BAILOUTS THAT HAVE GONE... |
| 00:41:22 |
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18 UNDER THE NEW PROVISION. |
| 00:41:24 |
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YOU BRING THIS BEFORE US AS A JUSTIFICATION FOR THE LEGISLATION? OBVIOUSLY QUITE IMPRACTICAL FOR ... |
| 00:41:33 |
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THAT PRECISE ARGUMENT WAS MADE TO CONGRESS IN 2006 AND IT WAS REJECTED. |
| 00:41:38 |
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THE QUESTION IS WHETHER IT'S RIGHT NOT WHETHER CONGRESS REJECTED IT. |
| 00:41:42 |
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I THINK IT'S NOT RIGHT BECAUSE THE TESTIMONY FOUND THAT STATES ARE ABLE TO BAIL OUT, BUT THEY DON'T.... |
| 00:41:55 |
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SECTION TWO -- THAT'S GREAT. YOU GET A DECLARATORY JUDGMENT. A BENEDICTION. AND YOU SKIP OFF WITHOUT... |
| 00:42:20 |
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I DON'T THINK THAT'S A QUITE FAIR CHARACTER SAIX. INDEED, 90 OF THE 110 REPRESENTATITISS C COMING... |
| 00:42:49 |
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I THINK THIS COURT SHOULD BE -- TO SECOND GUESS THE MOTIVATIONS OF CONGRESS -- |
| 00:43:03 |
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WE HAVE BEFORE US, REPRESENTATIONS OF THE COUNTY IN WHICH THE DISTRICT IS LOCATED AND SEVERAL OF THE... |
| 00:43:52 |
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THAT'S PRECISELY RIGHT JUSTICE GINSBURG. WHAT THE COVERED JURISDICTIONS ALSO SAY IS THAT THE COURT... |
| 00:44:09 |
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THE OTHER SIDE IS NOT INSISTING THEY BE KICKED OUT. IF THEY WANT TO VOLUNTARILY STAY IN, FINE. IN... |
| 00:44:35 |
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THIS COURT IS RECOGNIZING THE BRIEF OF THE COVERED JURISDICTIONS, REQUIRING THIS -- IF I COULD RETURN... |
| 00:45:02 |
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CASTEN BACK SAID THERE HAS BEEN AN INGENIOUS DEFIANCE AND THAT WAS CERTAINLY TRUE AS OF THE TIME TO... |
| 00:45:41 |
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THAT IS CORRECT. IT WASN'T A SURRENDERING OF POWER. I DON'T QUITE THINK SAID THAT DEFIANCE WAS A... |
| 00:46:28 |
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COULD I ASK YOU THIS QUESTION ABOUT BAILOUT. THERE'S A VERY ODD ASPECT TO THIS CASE. WE HAVE AN IMMENSE... |
| 00:47:05 |
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AGAIN, THIS COURT HAS REPEATEDLY SAID THAT THIS CONGRESS CAN LEGISLATE ON A STATE BY STATE LEVEL.... |
| 00:47:28 |
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IS IT THE CASE THAT THERE'S NO DISCRIMINATION GOING ON, NO EVASION GOING ON IN IN THIS LITTLE UTILITY... |
| 00:47:45 |
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YES, IN REJECTING THAT ARGUMENT WAS THAT IT'S NOT THAT DISCRIMINATION CAN'T BE DOWN AT THE UNIT BY... |
| 00:47:58 |
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THAT WAS 1980? |
| 00:48:00 |
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THAT'S CORRECT. |
| 00:48:02 |
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27 YEARS AGO, THERE HAVE BEEN 15 BAILOUTS SINCE THEN. IS THAT WHAT YOU THINK CONGRESS CONTEMPLATED... |
| 00:48:10 |
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FIRST OF ALL, THERE WAS A PROVISION IN '80. IT WAS AMENDED IN '82, AND YES, I THINK CONGRESS -- |
| 00:48:23 |
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LESS THAN ONE YEAR? |
| 00:48:25 |
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TO MAKE IT EASIER FOR POLITICAL SUBDIVISIONS TO BAIL OUT. THAT THEN MA MATERIALIZED, BECAUSE STATES... |
| 00:48:41 |
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I THOUGHT OUR OPINION IN THE CITY OF BERNIE SAID THAT THE PROBLEM IN SECTION FIVE LEGISLATION ADDRESSES... |
| 00:48:59 |
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I DO. I THINK THE REPORT, A 16,000-PAGE TRACK RECORD -- I DO AGREE THAT THEY WENT STATE BY STATE... |
| 00:49:38 |
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ONE MORE THING ON BAILOUT. IT KEEPS TELLING HERCULES, YOU DID A GOOD JOB, BUT YOU HAVE ANOTHER THING... |
| 00:50:17 |
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THE BAILOUT PROVISION WORKS NOTHING LIKE THE WAY IT MIGHT BE HI POTH SIZED. EVERY COUNTY THAT'S ASKED... |
| 00:50:50 |
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THAT'S INCORRECT AS I UNDERSTAND IT, FOR TRAVIS COUNTY, WITHIN TRAVIS COUNTY, SOMETHING LIKE 106 POLITICAL... |
| 00:51:16 |
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THE WAY THE STATUTE WORKS, THEY HAVE TO GO TO THE 107 SUBUNITS, THIS IS FEASIBLE BECAUSE THEY'RE UNDER... |
| 00:51:29 |
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TRAVIS COUNTY IS NOT THE SUPERIOR OF MANY OF THOSE SUBUNITS AS IT IS NOT OF THIS DISTRICT HERE. THIS... |
| 00:51:39 |
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AGAIN, I THINK THAT'S A DISTINCTION WITHOUT A DIFFERENCE. THEY HAVE ALL THE REGISTRATION DATA AND... |
| 00:51:56 |
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THE NUMBER IS 18? |
| 00:52:00 |
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THE NUMBER IS 18. |
| 00:52:10 |
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THANK YOU. |
| 00:52:12 |
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MR. CHEER JUSTICE AND MAY IT PLEASE THE COURT. OUR LONG EXPERIENCE DEMONSTRATES THAT RACIAL DISCRIMINATION... |
| 00:53:06 |
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I THINK THAT'S ABSOLUTELY RIGHT. SECTION TWO CASES ARE VERY EXPENSIVE. THEY'RE VERY LONG. I THINK... |
| 00:53:30 |
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AS THE COURT SAID WHEN IT FIRST WAS PRESENTED WITH THIS QUESTION OF THE COVERAGE FORMULA, CONGRESS... |
| 00:53:57 |
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IS IT YOUR POSITION THAT TODAY, SOUTHERNERS ARE MORE LIKELY TO DES CRIMINATE THAN NORTHERNERS? |
| 00:54:05 |
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I WOULDN'T FRAME IT IN THIS WAY. I THINK THE RECORD DOES REVEAL THAT DISCRIMINATION IN THE COVERED... |
| 00:54:27 |
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SO YOUR ANSWER IS YES? |
| 00:54:28 |
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I THINK THAT IT'S FAIR TO SAY THAT THE PATTERN HAS BEEN MORE REPETITIOUS VIOLATIONS AND MORE ONE-OFF... |
| 00:55:23 |
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SO I GUESS THAT POINT DEPENDS UPON THE ASUNLGTS THAT -- OPPOSED TO GOOD POLICY. |
| 00:55:32 |
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I THINK THE ISSUE WAS THAT YOU HAD A LONG STANDING INCUMBENT AND THE TIMING OF THOR THORLYTHORETHEOREOREOR... |
| 00:56:00 |
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INCUMBENT PROTECTION TAKES PLACE IN THE NORTH AS WELL AS THE SOUTH. |
| 00:56:07 |
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BY ALL MEANS, BUT IN THIS STANCE INSTANCE, WAS TO CUT OFF THE LATINO VOTERS. BUT CERTAINLY THAT IS... |
| 00:56:18 |
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I READ, I FORGET WHAT IT WAS. WHAT WAS THE VOTE ON THIS 2006? 98-0 IN THE SENATE. WHAT WAS IN THE... |
| 00:56:31 |
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IT WAS 33-390, I BELIEVE. |
| 00:56:33 |
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33-390. YOU KNOW, THE ISRAELI SUPREME COURT USED TO HAVE A RULE THAT IF THE DEATH PENALTY WAS PRONOUNCED... |
| 00:57:15 |
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JUSI THINK SOME DID VOTE AGAINST THE ACT. 33 MEMBERS OF THE HOUSE INDEED, BUT THE REASON THEY VOTED... |
| 00:58:01 |
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BUT THE QUESTION IS, THIS IS UNLIKE ACCESS TO BUILDINGS BY PEOPLE WHO ARE IN WHEELCHAIRS. THERE HAS... |
| 00:58:31 |
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CONGRESS HAD A MORE SPECIFIC REASON AS I UNDERSTAND THE RECORD. THERE WAS A SPECIFIC AMENDMENT TO... |
| 01:00:10 |
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SO WHAT IS THE REASON, IN YOUR OPINION, IF YOU HAD TO SUMMARIZE IN A MINUTE OR TWO, THE REASON THAT... |
| 01:00:40 |
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IS THAT IT WANTED TO STAY THE COURSE OF RIDDING THE JURISDICTIONS. SUBSEQUENT HAVE SPOKE ABOUT RIDDING... |
| 01:00:58 |
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WOULD YOU SAY FROM YOUR EXPERIENCE, I'M SURE YOUR VERY KNOWLEDGEABLE ABOUT THIS, THAT THERE IS GREATER... |
| 01:01:20 |
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I CAN'T PRECISELY QUANTIFY THE QUANTUM OF DISCRIMINATION IN THOSE STATES, BUT I THINK CONGRESS'S WAS... |
| 01:01:30 |
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VIRGINIA THE FIRST STATE IN THE UNION TO ELECT A BLACK GOVERNOR? |
| 01:01:35 |
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YES, INDEED IT WAS, AND YET THAT CERTAINLY DID NOT -- |
| 01:01:40 |
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BLACK CHIEF JUSTICE OF THE SUPREME COURT CURRENTLY? |
| 01:01:43 |
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I TAKE THE POINT, BUT IT'S NOT QUITE FAIR TO SAY, AS MY PREDECESSOR AT THE PODIUM MADE THE POINT,... |
| 01:02:31 |
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WOULD THE -- FIRST 15 PAGES. I THINK MAKES A GOOD DEMONSTRATION OF A DISCREET DESACT AND THE BRIEF... |
| 01:03:02 |
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I THINK THE BEST EVIDENCE OF THE COMPARISON QUESTION TO WHICH YOU'RE RETURNING IS THE SECTION TWO... |
| 01:04:04 |
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THE CASES YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT INCLUDE BOTH INTENTIONAL AND IMPACT CASES. SECTION FIVE COVERS ONLY... |
| 01:04:41 |
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I THINK THERE ARE TWO RESPONSES. FIRST, THE RELEVANT ASSESSMENT IS NOT SIMPLY IS RATE. AS THE LOWER... |
| 01:05:37 |
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THANK YOU. |
| 01:05:41 |
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HOW LONG DID IT TAKE CONGRESS TO COMPILE THIS 13,000-PAGE RECORD? |
| 01:05:47 |
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APPROXIMATELY TEN MONTHS. |
| 01:05:50 |
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AND HOW LONG WOULD IT HAVE TAKEN TO COMPILE THIS IN EVERY STATE, OR IN THESE STATES, DISTRICT BY DISTRICT?... |
| 01:05:58 |
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I CAN'T PUT A PRECISE TIME ON IT, BUT IT WOULD HAVE BEEN CERTAINLY A COUPLE OF MORE YEARS. THE TIME... |
| 01:06:16 |
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SO YOUR POSITION IS THAT IT MAKES NO DIFFERENCE IF DISCRIMINATION IN THE NON-COVERED JURISDICTION... |
| 01:06:35 |
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I DON'T THINK IT DOESN'T MATTER AT ALL. IN LIGHT OF THE RECORD BEFORE IT, IT'S JUDGMENT TO STAY THE... |
| 01:07:02 |
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SO THEY CAN ADDRESS THE COVERED JURISDICTIONS WITHOUT LOOKING AT ALL TO THE REST OF THE COUNTRY. |
| 01:07:10 |
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I THINK THAT IF THINGS WERE FLIPPED AND DISCRIMINATION WAS MUCH WORSE OUTSIDE, THAT WOULD REFLECT... |
| 01:07:22 |
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THANK YOU. |
| 01:07:28 |
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THANK YOU. |
| 01:07:32 |
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MR. COLEMAN, YOU HAVE FIVE MINUTES. |
| 01:07:35 |
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BUT CONGRESS DIDN'T ASK WHETHER DISCRIMINATION IS WORSE IN TENNESSEE OR ARKANSAS THAN IN VIRGINIA... |
| 01:08:05 |
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YOU SHOULD HAVE THE CHANCE TO ANSWER THE SAME QUESTION. |
| 01:08:11 |
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YOU HEARD MY QUESTION. |
| 01:08:12 |
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THE TIME QUESTION. |
| 01:08:13 |
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I STRONGLY DISAGREE WITH THAT. AEI PUT IN A NUMBER OF REPORTS THAT EVALUATED THINGS ON THE GROUND... |
| 01:08:36 |
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WE NOW HAVE 25 YEARS, OR 24 YEARS TO LOOK AT THE REST OF THE COUNTRY. ARE THEY DOING THAT? |
| 01:08:44 |
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NO. THAT'S WHAT CONGRESS DID IN 1982. IT SAID 25 YEARS. THAT 25 YEARS HAS GONE BY. |
| 01:08:54 |
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WELL THIS COURT SAID WHAT WAS THE YEAR OF -- IT WAS NOT 1982. IT WAS 2000 SOMETHING. THIS COURT THOUGHT... |
| 01:09:11 |
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CONGRESS'S JUSTIFICATION, AS WE'VE HEARD FROM COUNCIL IN LIGHT OF OUR VOCAL SOCIETY AND THE FACT THAT... |
| 01:09:29 |
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DOES YOUR CASE WHICH WILLCHALLENGE AT ALL FOR CAUSING STATES TO BECOME COVERED JURISDICTIONS? |
| 01:09:35 |
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WELL, THE ONLY STANDARDS THAT EXIST TO USE A TEST OF DEVICE IN THE 1960s -- |
| 01:09:44 |
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HAVE YOU CHALLENGED THAT FOR MAKING -- |
| 01:09:47 |
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I DON'T THINK WE'VE CHALLENGED -- |
| 01:09:50 |
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SOME STATES ARE COVERED AND SOME ARE NOT BECAUSE OF SOME REQUIREMENTS THE STATUTE IMPOSED. I DIDN'T... |
| 01:10:03 |
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NO, WE DO CHALLENGE THEM -- |
| 01:10:05 |
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WHY IS IT RELEVANT THERE ARE A LOT OF STATES OUT THERE WHO ARE NOT COVERED? |
| 01:10:11 |
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BECAUSE THIS COURT'S DISCUSSION OF THESE ISSUES IN MORRIS AND GARRETT INDICATE THAT IT DOES MATTER... |
| 01:10:37 |
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IS CONGRESS FAILED TO EXTEND IT TO OTHER PARTS OF THE COUNTRY? |
| 01:10:42 |
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I DON'T THINK THAT'S OUR ARGUMENT. IT'S PARTIALLY UNCONSTITUTIONAL BECAUSE IT EVEN FAILED TO LOOK... |
| 01:11:37 |
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THE DISTRICT WILL NEVER BE IN RACIAL BLOCK VOTING BECAUSE IT DOESN'T, IT BOUNDARIES DON'T CHANGE.... |
| 01:11:46 |
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THAT'S TRUE, JUSTICE GINSBURG, BUT IT'S IMPORTANT FOR THE COURT THE CONSIDER THE FACT THAT CONGRESS... |
| 01:12:22 |
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AS 2006 SAY WELL CONGRESS OBVIOUSLY HAD IN MIND THAT THIS WOULD BE ENFORCED CONSISTENT WITH COURT'S... |
| 01:12:32 |
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WE BELIEVE THAT THE INTERPRETATION OF THE ACT OR -- EXCUSE ME THE PASSAGE OF THE AMENDMENTS IN 2006... |
| 01:13:04 |
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COUNSEL, THE COURT IS SUBMITTED. |
| 01:13:07 |
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COURT IS ADJOURNED UNTIL MONDAY NEXT, 10:00. |
| 01:13:11 |
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AND WE HAVE BEEN HEARING ORAL ARGUMENTS OF TODAY'S SUPREME COURT CASE ON WHETHER CERTAIN STATES AND... |
NOTE: The transcript for this program was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.
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