Justice Department Nominations Hearing

Feb 10, 2009

Senate Committee Judiciary

A hearing was held on the nominations of Elena Kagan to be solicitor general of the U.S. Department of Justice and for Thomas J. Perrelli to be associate attorney general. They testified on a number of issues including the use of torture, Justice Department hiring and retention practices, and the powers of the executive branch of government.
A hearing was held on the nominations of Elena Kagan to be solicitor general of the U.S. Department of Justice and for Thomas J. Perrelli to be associate attorney general. They testified on a number of issues including the use of torture, Justice Department hiring and retention practices, and the powers of the executive branch of government.

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TRANSCRIPT

TIME SPEAKER TEXT
00:02:36 Cardin, Benjamin L.U.S. Senator

The committee will come to order. First, let me

thank Chairman Leahy for allowing me to chair...

00:08:30 Specter, ArlenU.S. Senator

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

At the outset may I say that your work on the committee has been

outstanding....

00:08:51 Cardin, Benjamin L.U.S. Senator

(Inaudible.)

00:08:51 Specter, ArlenU.S. Senator

-- acting chairman of the committee, which is

quite a testimonial to you. But we've worked together...

00:15:41 Cardin, Benjamin L.U.S. Senator

Thank you, Senator Specter.

At this time I'll recognize Senator Jack Reed from Rhode Island

for...

00:15:51 Reed, John "Jack" F.U.S. Senator

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And thank you,

Ranking Member Specter.

It is an honor to appear...

00:18:49 Cardin, Benjamin L.U.S. Senator

Thank you very much, Senator Reed. I appreciate

you being here.

At this time I would ask...

00:19:53 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

(Off mike.) I've also got my brother-in-law

Kevin, who made the trip from Madison, Wisconsin;...

00:20:15 Cardin, Benjamin L.U.S. Senator

Thank you.

Dean Kagan.

00:20:19 Kagan, ElenaDean

(Off mike) -- and I left most of mine at home. But I

have two wonderful brothers who are here...

00:21:01 Cardin, Benjamin L.U.S. Senator

Well, we welcome your families and we know the

sacrifices that they have to make in regards...

00:21:22 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Thank you.

Mr. Chairman, Senator Specter, and members of the committee,

thank you for...

00:25:29 Cardin, Benjamin L.U.S. Senator

Thank you very much.

Dean Kagan.

00:25:32 Kagan, ElenaDean

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Mr. Chairman and members of the committee, I'm deeply honored to

be...

00:31:41 Cardin, Benjamin L.U.S. Senator

Well, thank you. We thank both of you for your

opening statements.

We are going to have...

00:33:06 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Well, Senator, with respect I think the answer to

the last part of your question is none. You've...

00:34:16 Cardin, Benjamin L.U.S. Senator

That's the answer I expected to hear from you, but

let me just caution you. You are responsible...

00:35:16 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Well, Senator, the attorney general has already

made clear that that will be a significant priority...

00:36:16 Cardin, Benjamin L.U.S. Senator

Thank you.

Dean Kagan, I very much support your statement of aggressively

enforcing the...

00:37:16 Kagan, ElenaDean

Thank you, Senator Cardin. It's an extremely

important question. Every solicitor general nominee...

00:39:06 Cardin, Benjamin L.U.S. Senator

I thank you for that response. I would also hope

that there would be some transparency in making...

00:39:21 Specter, ArlenU.S. Senator

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Mr. Perrelli, I sent you a letter on the issue of congressional

oversight...

00:40:17 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Senator, the passage that you provided, I agree

with respect to the description of the scope...

00:40:47 Specter, ArlenU.S. Senator

Well, would you supplement your answer by

specifying what kind of extenuating circumstances...

00:40:53 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Well, I think that certainly you have the

situation of executive privilege and how --

00:40:57 Specter, ArlenU.S. Senator

I want you to supplement your answer in writing

because I've only got seven minutes.

00:41:02 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

I will do.

00:41:02 Specter, ArlenU.S. Senator

But you said you would adopt those as a

generalization but there might be some extenuating circumstance...

00:41:13 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Thank you, Senator.

00:41:13 Specter, ArlenU.S. Senator

The Washington Post has an account today on the

state secrets doctrine. The Obama administration...

00:41:57 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Senator, I think with respect to the question

about any particular case, I think it would require...

00:42:07 Specter, ArlenU.S. Senator

Well, would you take a look at the case and the

statute which Senator Kennedy and I have pending...

00:42:17 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

I will, Senator.

00:42:17 Specter, ArlenU.S. Senator

There have been a large number of cases by the

Department of Justice in taking monetary fines...

00:44:13 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Senator, with respect to that assertion, I think

the argument was that Congress cannot, through...

00:44:38 Specter, ArlenU.S. Senator

Well, there is concurrent jurisdiction between the

state courts and the federal courts, double...

00:44:59 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

I think the argument that we made in that case was

that what the impact, the effect of Congress'...

00:45:11 Specter, ArlenU.S. Senator

Well, that may be the impact. But would you

supplement your answer with why you think Congress...

00:45:21 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

I will do that, Senator.

00:45:21 Specter, ArlenU.S. Senator

Dean Kagan, coming to the citation that I had

mentioned earlier about how strongly you felt...

00:47:29 Kagan, ElenaDean

Well Senator, thank you for raising that memo. I

first looked at that memo -- thought about...

00:47:52 Specter, ArlenU.S. Senator

You don't have to go any further. (Laughter)

What are you -- you're telling us you won't make...

00:48:02 Kagan, ElenaDean

You should never make the same mistake twice.

00:48:07 Specter, ArlenU.S. Senator

I wish I could follow that advice. (Scattered

laughter.)

One final question, Mr. Chairman....

00:50:02 Kagan, ElenaDean

That's a very interesting question Senator. You

know, the Supreme Court's jurisdiction is of...

00:52:22 Specter, ArlenU.S. Senator

Thank you, Ms. Hagan. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

00:52:22 Cardin, Benjamin L.U.S. Senator

Thank you. Senator Feingold.

00:52:28 Feingold, RussellU.S. Senator

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Dean Kagan,

congratulations on your nomination. I was personally delighted...

00:53:49 Kagan, ElenaDean

Absolutely. There is simply no question that when

one assumes the solicitor general's role,...

00:54:26 Feingold, RussellU.S. Senator

I agree with that. And he did do a superb job,

and I could have sworn he almost was believing...

00:54:38 Kagan, ElenaDean

For that day he was persuaded, and that's all you

need.

00:54:42 Feingold, RussellU.S. Senator

Let me ask you, now, about the conflict of

interest restriction on those who serve in the solicitor...

00:55:42 Kagan, ElenaDean

I will, Senator Feingold. To be truthful, this is

not a question that I've thought anything...

00:56:05 Feingold, RussellU.S. Senator

Thank you so much. Mr. Perrilli. I

congratulate you as well. You have a truly stellar reputation....

00:57:28 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Senator, with respect to the particular case, I

think I would need to consult with others at...

00:58:25 Feingold, RussellU.S. Senator

But you will, if confirmed --

00:58:25 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

If --

00:58:25 Feingold, RussellU.S. Senator

-- give me an answer about whether I'll get a

classified briefing on this.

00:58:32 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

I will give you an answer, if confirmed, Senator.

00:58:32 Feingold, RussellU.S. Senator

And I just want to confirm -- I believe that

you've indicated to Senator Specter that you would...

00:58:49 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

I will, Senator, and I look forward to speaking

with the committee about that if I'm confirmed.

00:58:52 Feingold, RussellU.S. Senator

There's a lot of suspicion of the government out

there, and this is important legislation that...

00:59:21 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Senator, I appreciate the question. In my prior

service at the Department of Justice I have...

00:59:54 Feingold, RussellU.S. Senator

Thank you. Thanks, Mr. Chairman.

00:59:54 Cardin, Benjamin L.U.S. Senator

Thank you, Senator Feingold. Senator Coburn?

00:59:58 Coburn, Tom A. M.D.U.S. Senator

Thank you, and welcome to you both.

Ms. Kagan, one of the things that you said earlier was explaining

your...

01:00:35 Kagan, ElenaDean

That's a very interesting hypothetical question,

Senator.

I'll say a little bit about...

01:01:55 Coburn, Tom A. M.D.U.S. Senator

Okay, thank you very much. Of all I've read, the

only real criticism that you've had is that...

01:02:38 Kagan, ElenaDean

I think it's a very fair and important question. I'm

very confident that I'm up to this part...

01:02:48 Coburn, Tom A. M.D.U.S. Senator

I have no doubt.

01:02:48 Kagan, ElenaDean

And I'll tell you a little bit about why. I think

when you get up to that podium at the Supreme...

01:04:14 Coburn, Tom A. M.D.U.S. Senator

And some of them, the record would show, had some

difficulties in their presentations before...

01:04:26 Kagan, ElenaDean

Now I want to know who you mean.

(Laughter.)

01:04:28 Coburn, Tom A. M.D.U.S. Senator

Well, my staff is going to invite you to come by

and visit with me, so we'll have a great conversation...

01:04:42 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Thank you, Senator. I have been heard to say that

you are the most important member of this...

01:04:50 Coburn, Tom A. M.D.U.S. Senator

Mr. Perrelli, the Department of Justice is

responsible for enforcing our nation's obscenity...

01:05:22 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Senator, with respect to that act, I think that it

is likely that the responsibility for that...

01:06:01 Coburn, Tom A. M.D.U.S. Senator

The same would apply for the Children's Internet

Protection Act and the Child Protection Obscenity...

01:06:09 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

To the best of my knowledge those would be most

likely to fall under the criminal jurisdiction...

01:06:19 Coburn, Tom A. M.D.U.S. Senator

Do you think any of your past experience in terms

of those that you've defended or advocated...

01:06:32 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

No, I do not, Senator.

01:06:32 Coburn, Tom A. M.D.U.S. Senator

Thank you. Last year I participated in legislation

targeting combating child exploitation and...

01:07:10 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Senator, I think with respect to any enactment of

Congress, my role will be to defend that statute...

01:07:21 Coburn, Tom A. M.D.U.S. Senator

One final question. Do you personally believe that

adult obscenity contributes to the sexual...

01:07:33 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Senator, I can't say that I have any recollection

of looking at social science at all, but I...

01:07:53 Coburn, Tom A. M.D.U.S. Senator

But it's not your view that that in itself, adult

obscenity, contributes to child exploitation?

01:08:04 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

I have not looked -- with respect to adult

obscenity -- and we're talking about unlawful materials...

01:08:37 Coburn, Tom A. M.D.U.S. Senator

I'll be happy to send you the literature on adult

obscenity and child predators.

Thank...

01:08:49 Cardin, Benjamin L.U.S. Senator

Without objection. And at this point it might be

appropriate, Senator Coburn, to just put into...

01:09:22 Klobuchar, AmyU.S. Senator

Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.

Congratulations to both of you. Dean Kagan, I noted that...

01:10:54 Kagan, ElenaDean

Well, thank you, Senator. It's an interesting

question, and I think I'm going to disappoint...

01:12:25 Klobuchar, AmyU.S. Senator

And I don't question the solicitor general's

role with that at all. I was just wondering, some...

01:12:36 Kagan, ElenaDean

Well, you can see why when the government wins the

case --

01:12:41 Klobuchar, AmyU.S. Senator

No, I know, but, I mean, there has just been --

01:12:41 Kagan, ElenaDean

-- one would want to rest there.

(Laughter.)

01:12:46 Klobuchar, AmyU.S. Senator

I understand that. I just meant becoming

involved in those cases because we've just seen some...

01:12:52 Kagan, ElenaDean

Yes, and it's very interesting. I would love to talk

to you about this further and to hear some...

01:12:56 Klobuchar, AmyU.S. Senator

Okay. Thank you.

Mr. Perrelli, I do note that your son seemed to quite down when

he was...

01:13:10 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

It is sad but true.

01:13:10 Klobuchar, AmyU.S. Senator

Okay.

01:13:10 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

I do believe that our children mimic what they see

from their parents.

01:13:14 Klobuchar, AmyU.S. Senator

All right, good. Well, I was a prosecutor for

eight years, running an office of about 400 people,...

01:14:06 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Well, Senator, I think it is an important

question. And the experience of having worked through...

01:15:15 Klobuchar, AmyU.S. Senator

One of the other things that I think is so

important is how the Department of Justice works...

01:15:40 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Certainly, Senator, and it's a critically

important question because I think we all have to...

01:16:37 Klobuchar, AmyU.S. Senator

And I'm out of time here, but two areas that I

hope you'll consider in the future is just white...

01:17:01 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

I will, Senator.

01:17:01 Klobuchar, AmyU.S. Senator

Thank you.

01:17:01 Cardin, Benjamin L.U.S. Senator

Senator Kyl.

01:17:04 Kyl, JonU.S. Senator

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Dean Kagan,

I'd like to ask a favor. If you would please read, and...

01:17:38 Kagan, ElenaDean

Senator, if I may?

01:17:38 Kyl, JonU.S. Senator

Yes.

01:17:38 Kagan, ElenaDean

I was told yesterday -- I suppose one of your staff

said that you had an interest in this article,...

01:17:47 Kyl, JonU.S. Senator

Well, good. I didn't want to catch you by surprise.

01:17:47 Kagan, ElenaDean

No, it was very fair, but I just want to say I

completely agree with you. I think it's a very...

01:18:05 Kyl, JonU.S. Senator

For those who haven't, it's a bit of a template for

how an SG approaches decision-making about...

01:21:11 Kagan, ElenaDean

I appreciate it. And first, let me -- let me say I

completely agree with you on the necessity...

01:23:11 Kyl, JonU.S. Senator

Sure, I appreciate that. The greatest knowledgeable

surgeon, though, still has to get those...

01:24:19 Kagan, ElenaDean

I absolutely would have, Senator, and I'm glad you

asked that question because the answer is...

01:25:14 Kyl, JonU.S. Senator

Again, thank you, and I would appreciate the chance

just to visit privately for a little bit.

01:25:18 Cardin, Benjamin L.U.S. Senator

Senator Kyl, thank you for your inquiry.

Let me just, if I might, put into the record -- I think...

01:26:17 Feinstein, DianneU.S. Senator

Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman,

and welcome to the both of you and congratulations and certainly...

01:27:33 Kagan, ElenaDean

Well, Senator, you ask a question that I do think

goes to the role of the Solicitor General's...

01:28:33 Feinstein, DianneU.S. Senator

Yes, well of course, there are many of us. I

happen to be one that believed that the EPA was...

01:28:58 Kagan, ElenaDean

I think that the presumption is just like the

presumption is that the solicitor general's office...

01:29:11 Feinstein, DianneU.S. Senator

Okay. Let me switch topics and ask, are you

both familiar with the bill that we spent a great...

01:29:25 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Senator, I'm generally familiar with it.

01:29:25 Kagan, ElenaDean

The same.

01:29:28 Feinstein, DianneU.S. Senator

How about you, Ms. Kagan? Well, you mentioned

the Jackson formula from Youngstown. And as you...

01:31:00 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Senator, I haven't looked at the exclusivity

provisions for that precise purpose. I would, echoing...

01:31:29 Feinstein, DianneU.S. Senator

Ms. Kagan?

01:31:29 Kagan, ElenaDean

I can't say anything more than that.

01:31:35 Feinstein, DianneU.S. Senator

Okay. Have either of you had an opportunity to

review the Geneva Conventions?

01:31:42 Kagan, ElenaDean

Again, generally, Senator.

01:31:45 Feinstein, DianneU.S. Senator

With respect to the laws of war, which

essentially cover the detention of an enemy combatant...

01:31:54 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Senator, I've had occasion to review that in the

context of reviewing the Supreme Court's decisions...

01:32:01 Feinstein, DianneU.S. Senator

Well, let me ask you this question, then. Do

you believe they are sufficient to detain an individual...

01:32:16 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Senator, I think I would want to consult further

with experts in the field. The description...

01:32:44 Feinstein, DianneU.S. Senator

The reason I raise this is because I think it's

going to be a fundamental question as we consider...

01:33:36 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Well, Senator, I think, as I indicated, my

understanding is that that is indeed what the Hamdi...

01:33:52 Feinstein, DianneU.S. Senator

Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

01:33:52 Cardin, Benjamin L.U.S. Senator

Thank you.

Senator Graham.

01:33:56 Graham, LindseyU.S. Senator

To pick up where Senator Feinstein

left off, which is an excellent question -- and this country...

01:34:16 Kagan, ElenaDean

Under normal criminal law? Yes, I do agree with you.

01:34:19 Graham, LindseyU.S. Senator

And if you had a criminal statute that would allow

someone to be held forever without trial,...

01:34:26 Kagan, ElenaDean

That seems right, Senator.

01:34:26 Graham, LindseyU.S. Senator

Okay. Now, if one's at war -- let me ask this. Do

you believe we're at war?

01:34:34 Kagan, ElenaDean

I do, Senator.

01:34:34 Graham, LindseyU.S. Senator

Okay, let me read from Mr. Holder. Would you

consider him your boss?

01:34:40 Kagan, ElenaDean

(Laughs.) In a manner of speaking, Senator. I guess

he can fire me, so that makes him my boss.

01:34:44 Graham, LindseyU.S. Senator

Okay. Well, that would make him your boss. But it

seems to be -- I think he'd be a good boss.

01:34:50 Kagan, ElenaDean

I think so too.

01:34:50 Graham, LindseyU.S. Senator

And I think you'd be very qualified for your job.

I asked him, "Do you think we're at war?"...

01:35:18 Kagan, ElenaDean

It's easy to agree with my boss in that circumstance.

01:35:21 Graham, LindseyU.S. Senator

Okay. I asked him where the battlefield might be.

If we're at war, I asked him where would the...

01:36:15 Kagan, ElenaDean

(Off mike.)

01:36:15 Graham, LindseyU.S. Senator

Well, I certainly do too. And I told him I thought

what he was speaking of was the moral high...

01:36:58 Kagan, ElenaDean

I do.

01:36:58 Graham, LindseyU.S. Senator

So that gets us back to Senator Feinstein's

question. Under the law of armed conflict, as I...

01:37:54 Kagan, ElenaDean

I think it makes sense, and I think you're correct

that that is the law.

01:37:57 Graham, LindseyU.S. Senator

So America needs to get ready for this proposition

that some people are going to be detained...

01:38:35 Kagan, ElenaDean

It does, indeed.

01:38:35 Graham, LindseyU.S. Senator

It has to have substantial due process.

01:38:39 Kagan, ElenaDean

It does, indeed.

01:38:39 Graham, LindseyU.S. Senator

And it should have an independent judiciary

involved in making that decision beyond the executive...

01:38:44 Kagan, ElenaDean

Absolutely.

01:38:44 Graham, LindseyU.S. Senator

So we can go tell the world that this person is

being held off the battlefield not because one...

01:39:04 Kagan, ElenaDean

I do, Senator.

01:39:04 Graham, LindseyU.S. Senator

I look forward to working with you and this new

administration how to come up with a process...

01:40:29 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Well, I think, Senator, simply by identifying the

problem, whatever mechanisms and laws we have...

01:41:13 Graham, LindseyU.S. Senator

Well, thank you, both. I think you are excellent

choices, and you'll do a good job for the country....

01:41:19 Kagan, ElenaDean

Thank you, Senator.

01:41:19 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Thank you, Senator.

01:41:19 Cardin, Benjamin L.U.S. Senator

Thank you.

Senator Whitehouse.

01:41:23 Whitehouse, SheldonU.S. Senator

Thank you. Just to follow up on

Senator Graham's question, we passed legislation very recently...

01:43:35 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

I certainly can make that assurance, Senator.

01:43:38 Kagan, ElenaDean

Senator, I can as well. And one of the glories of

the Solicitor General's Office is that even...

01:43:56 Whitehouse, SheldonU.S. Senator

It has distinguished itself in that regard.

We've heard disturbing testimony about the disassembly...

01:46:06 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Well, Senator, I think it is an important

question. And I think there's no question on a forward-looking...

01:47:17 Whitehouse, SheldonU.S. Senator

So you are completely confident that the

existing performance evaluation and review process...

01:47:30 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

I can't say that I'm completely confident. It's

something I would want to look at, if I'm confirmed,...

01:47:52 Whitehouse, SheldonU.S. Senator

Well, I certainly hope that that's the case.

And I'm prepared to accept that it may be the case....

01:48:39 Kagan, ElenaDean

Thank you, Senator.

01:48:39 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Thank you, Senator.

01:48:39 Cardin, Benjamin L.U.S. Senator

Senator Hatch.

01:48:42 Hatch, OrrinU.S. Senator

Well, thank you, Mr. Chairman.

I welcome both of you to the committee. I have great respect...

01:48:59 Kagan, ElenaDean

Thank you.

01:48:59 Hatch, OrrinU.S. Senator

No question about it. And I think it's evident by a

number of the professors who are here today,...

01:50:46 Kagan, ElenaDean

Senator, I don't know the case, and I'm not sure I

understand which solicitor general did what,...

01:50:54 Hatch, OrrinU.S. Senator

Well, the first solicitor general in President

Clinton's tenure.

01:50:58 Kagan, ElenaDean

I see. And then -- but then it was defended later?

01:51:02 Hatch, OrrinU.S. Senator

Yeah, it was. Well, actually, it turned out, I

think, all right in the end, but that was the...

01:51:10 Kagan, ElenaDean

Well, either way, Senator, I would have no difficulty

in this area whatsoever. I mean, I would...

01:51:27 Hatch, OrrinU.S. Senator

Well, in your book -- in your review of Professor

Stephen Carter's book on the confirmation...

01:51:43 Kagan, ElenaDean

The -- ?

01:51:43 Hatch, OrrinU.S. Senator

-- even about votes they would cast. How do you

square this with the principle that judges must...

01:51:54 Kagan, ElenaDean

It's a great question, Senator. And I'm not sure

that, sitting here today, I would agree with...

01:52:05 Hatch, OrrinU.S. Senator

(If you) want to know the truth, I remember when

Judge Bork was here, he had written some outlandish...

01:52:29 Kagan, ElenaDean

Right, right.

01:52:29 Hatch, OrrinU.S. Senator

And you're good at that.

01:52:29 Kagan, ElenaDean

(Laughs.) Well, thank you, Senator.

I was just going to say, you know, I wrote that when I was...

01:53:09 Hatch, OrrinU.S. Senator

Let me just say that I may not agree that Thurgood

Marshall was the greatest attorney of the...

01:53:45 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

(Laughs.)

01:53:45 Hatch, OrrinU.S. Senator

If you are confirmed to be associate attorney

general you will oversee the Justice Department's...

01:55:00 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Well, Senator, it's an important question. And I

agree with you that we need to continue the...

01:55:53 Hatch, OrrinU.S. Senator

Well, thank you. I want to -- I want to express my

regard for both of you. And I've really enjoyed...

01:56:19 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

(Laughs.)

01:56:19 Hatch, OrrinU.S. Senator

But, glad to have you here and glad you're willing

to serve.

01:56:24 Kagan, ElenaDean

Thank you, Senator.

01:56:24 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Thank you, Senator.

01:56:24 Cardin, Benjamin L.U.S. Senator

Thank you, Senator Hatch.

Senator Wyden.

01:56:27 Wyden, Ronald LeeU.S. Senator

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

I want to welcome both of our witnesses as well. I know we have

votes,...

01:57:14 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Well, Senator, I appreciate the question. And I

agree that as we -- particularly in the current...

01:58:40 Wyden, Ronald LeeU.S. Senator

You've told me that you'd look at putting more

agents on it, and more U.S. attorneys. I want...

01:58:55 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

I can, Senator.

01:58:55 Wyden, Ronald LeeU.S. Senator

Very good.

Second point for you, you represented the Recording Industry

Association, and...

01:59:25 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Senator, with respect to the enforcement of the

criminal copyright laws, that, again, would...

01:59:50 Wyden, Ronald LeeU.S. Senator

And you would support that?

01:59:50 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

I'd have not reason to disagree with it.

01:59:54 Wyden, Ronald LeeU.S. Senator

Okay.

One question for you, Ms. Kagan -- and I share Senator Hatch's

views about your...

02:01:14 Kagan, ElenaDean

Senator, I appreciate the question but I have this

urge, actually, to stay up at 50,000 feet...

02:01:19 Wyden, Ronald LeeU.S. Senator

I got the drift. (Laughter.)

02:01:19 Kagan, ElenaDean

-- for the reasons that you say -- you know, the

president has authorized a review of this case,...

02:02:00 Wyden, Ronald LeeU.S. Senator

Well, tell me, then, about the balance -- the

Constitutional balance, as you would think about...

02:02:18 Kagan, ElenaDean

Fighting terrorism ferociously and also fighting

terrorism within the rule of law. And those...

02:02:31 Wyden, Ronald LeeU.S. Senator

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

02:02:31 Cardin, Benjamin L.U.S. Senator

Senator Kaufman.

02:02:35 Kaufman, Edward "Ted" E.U.S. Senator

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Dean Kagan, Mr. Perrelli, I'm really pleased that you're taking

on...

02:04:02 Perrelli, Thomas J.Deputy Assistant Atty. General

Thank you, Senator.

02:04:02 Cardin, Benjamin L.U.S. Senator

Thank you, Senator Kaufman.

Let me just echo what Senator Kaufman has just said, and thank

both...

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  • Kagan, Elena
  • Perrelli, Thomas J.
  • Reed, John "Jack" F.
  • Cardin, Benjamin L.
  • Coburn, Tom A. M.D.
  • Feingold, Russell
  • Feinstein, Dianne
  • Graham, Lindsey
  • Hatch, Orrin
  • Kaufman, Edward "Ted" E.
  • Klobuchar, Amy
  • Kyl, Jon
  • Leahy, Patrick J.
  • Specter, Arlen
  • Whitehouse, Sheldon
  • Wyden, Ronald Lee

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