Exxon Valdez Supreme Court Case

Feb 28, 2008

C-SPAN | Washington Journal

Two attorneys not connected with the case analyzed the arguments in yesterday's Supreme Court case regarding the $2.5 billion dollar reduced award of punitive damages against Exxon in the Exxon Valdez oil spill nineteen years ago. Jonathan Hacker supported the Exxon position. Colette Routel opposed the Exxon position. Topics included whether .. Read More
Two attorneys not connected with the case analyzed the arguments in yesterday's Supreme Court case regarding the $2.5 billion dollar reduced award of punitive damages against Exxon in the Exxon Valdez oil spill nineteen years ago. Jonathan Hacker supported the Exxon position. Colette Routel opposed the Exxon position. Topics included whether corporations should be punished for the behavior of their employees under maritime law, and whether the amount of damages was excessive. They responded to telephone calls and electronic mail.

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TIME SPEAKER TEXT
00:00:16 Host WE'RE GOING TO BE TALKING ABOUT THE "EXXON VALDEZ" SUPREME COURT CASE ARGUED YESTERDAY IN FRONT OF...
00:00:51 Guest I THINK THE ARGUMENTS WENT FAIRLY WELL FOR THE PLAINTIFFS AND I'D LIKE TO START JUST BY SAYING THAT...
00:02:47 Host JONATHAN HACKER, GIVE US YOUR ASSESSMENT OF THE ARGUMENTS MADE YESTERDAY.
00:02:51 Guest WELL, YOU MAY EXPECT, I DISAGREE WITH MY COLLEAGUE'S VIEW OF THINGS. I WOULD SAY WE'RE CAUTIOUSLY...
00:04:01 Host BUT THE COASTLINE IS STILL DAMAGED AND FISHING INDUSTRY STILL DAMAGED.
00:04:05 Guest WELL, ACTUALLY NEITHER OF THOSE THINGS IS TRUE FROM THE EVIDENCE WE HAVE AVAILABLE. THE MOST RECENTLY...
00:05:13 Host COLETTE ROUTEL, IF THAT'S THE CASE AND THE AREA IS CLEANED UP AND THE AREA IS BACK UP AND RUNNING,...
00:05:26 Guest I THINK WHAT IS IMPORTANT IS EXXON NOT REQUIRED TO KEEP PAYING BUT EXXON AVOIDED PAYING THIS PUNITIVE...
00:06:05 Guest CAN I ANSWER QUICKLY?
00:06:06 Host PLEASE.
00:06:08 Guest THE USE AND ABUSE PROPOSITION I THINK IS COMPLETELY INDEFENSIBLE. YOU KNOW, WITH THIS -- MOST OF ...
00:07:23 Host WE ARE TALKING ABOUT THE "EXXON VALDEZ" CASE ARGUED BEFORE THE SUPREME COURT YESTERDAY WITH COLETTE...
00:08:34 Caller GOOD MORNING. HOW IS EVERYONE DOING THIS MORNING?
00:08:37 Guest VERY GOOD.
00:08:38 Host GO AHEAD.
00:08:40 Caller HELLO?
00:08:41 Guest YES, SIR. GO RIGHT AHEAD.
00:08:43 Caller HOW ARE YOU GUYS DOING THIS MORNING? I'M SORRY I WAS GETTING FEEDBACK THERE.
00:08:48 Host MAKE SURE AND TURN DOWN YOUR TELEVISION SET, OKAY.
00:08:52 Caller OKAY, I HAVE A VERY, VERY BIG [ BLEEP ].
00:08:54 Host NEXT CALL COMES FROM LONG BEACH ISLAND, NEW JERSEY ON OUR LINE FOR REPUBLICANS. GO AHEAD.
00:09:00 Caller YEAH, I'D LIKE -- I'D LIKE TO UNDERSTAND HOW ATTORNEY HACKER COULD DEFEND EXXON.
00:09:10 Host IN WHAT WAY?
00:09:12 Caller THEY JUST SEEM UNDEFENSIBLE. I THINK THEY HAVE TO TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR THE TRAGEDY THAT THEY INCURRED....
00:09:18 Guest EXXON DID. THAT'S VERY IMPORTANT TO EM FOR A SIZE FRCHLT THE DAY AFTER THE SPILL, EXXON ASSUMED RESPONSIBILITY,...
00:10:15 Host LET'S TAKE A CALL FROM ROGERSVILLE, TENNESSEE. GO AHEAD.
00:10:20 Caller YES, I HAVE A -- A QUESTION FOR BOTH OF THESE ATTORNEYS. SINCE THIS VALDEZ OIL SPILL IN '89, I HAVEN'T...
00:10:55 Host COLETTE ROUTEL, GO AHEAD, ANSWER THAT ONE FOR US.
00:10:59 Guest I'M CERTAINLY, AS A LAWYER, NOT GOING TO CALL FOR A BOYCOTT. I MEAN, I THINK THAT'S SOMETHING INDIVIDUALS...
00:11:41 Host WE HAVE THIS FRONT PAGE FROM THE "ANCHORAGE DAILY NEWS" WITH THE HEADED LINE EXXON MAKES LAST PITCH....
00:12:20 Caller GOOD MORNING. HOW ARE YOU TODAY?
00:12:22 Host SDWRUS FINE, SIR, GO AHEAD.
00:12:24 Caller I'D LIKE TO MAKE A COMMENT. I'M PREVIOUSLY A RESIDENT OF ALASKA AND MY COMMENT IS IS I THINK IT'S...
00:12:49 Host JONATHAN HACKER?
00:12:50 Guest WELL, THE QUESTION IS WHETHER THERE IS A BASIS IN LAW FOR [ INAUDIBLE ] EXXON MERELY BECAUSE IT IS...
00:13:39 Host OUR NEXT CALL COMES FROM WASILLA, ALASKA ON OUR LINE FOR REPUBLICANS. GOOD MORNING.
00:13:45 Caller GOOD MORNING. MY NAME IS DAVE AND I WAS ACTIVELY FISHING IN KODIAK AT THE TIME OF THE EXXON SPILL...
00:14:43 Host SIR, TELL ME ABOUT THE SYSTEM OR PROCESS YOU HAD TO GO THROUGH IN ORDER TO MAKE CLAIMS FOR COMPENSATION....
00:14:49 Caller IT'S UNBELIEVABLE. I'VE HAD TO GO THROUGH THIS CLAIMS AND COMPENSATION, GIVEN MY RECORDS AND DATA...
00:15:50 Host SIR, ONE MORE QUESTION. HAVE YOU GONE BACK TO FISHING OR MOVED TO A NEW OCCUPATION?
00:15:56 Caller NO, I'VE CONTINUED TO FISH BUT HAVE MOVED OUT OF THE GULF AND GONE TO THE BERRING SEA WHERE I CONTINUE...
00:16:35 Host COLETTE ROUTEL, GO AHEAD AND ADDRESS HIS CONCERNS.
00:16:39 Guest WELL, I THINK THESE COMMENTS IN QUESTION -- AND QUESTIONS POINT OUT THE FACT THERE IS WIDESPREAD SUPPORT...
00:17:43 Guest TWO QUICK POINTS ON THAT. FIRST OF ALL, IT'S VERY CLEAR THAT IF THE ACCIDENT HAPPENED ON LAND, THE...
00:18:59 Host NEXT CALL COMES FROM SENECA, MISSOURI ON OUR LINE FOR DEMOCRATS. SENECA?
00:19:07 Caller GOOD MORNING. GOOD MORNING.
00:19:08 Guest GOOD MORNING.
00:19:09 Caller I'D LIKE TO ASK ABOUT THE OWNERSHIP AND CONTROL OF THE "VALDEZ." MY UNDERSTANDING IS THE BUSH FAMILY...
00:19:28 Guest NOT TO MY KNOWLEDGE.
00:19:29 Host COLETTE ROUTEL, DO YOU KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THE OWNERSHIP OF THE "EXXON VALDEZ," IF IT IS CONNECTED...
00:19:36 Guest I DON'T KNOW THAT.
00:19:38 Host SHERMAN, ILLINOIS ON OUR LINE FOR REPUBLICANS.
00:19:40 Caller I THINK GEORGE BUSH WAS PILOTING ONE OF THE SHIPS, WASN'T HE? IT'S UNBELIEVABLE. LITTLE JOKE. THE...
00:20:44 Host MR. HACKER?
00:20:45 Guest I DON'T KNOW THE DETAILS OF THE COMPENSATION CLAIMS PROGRAM. THERE WAS A GROSS AMOUNT PAID WAS IN...
00:21:46 Host COLETTE ROUTEL, IS THERE ANYTHING WITH REGARD TO THE PROFITS THAT THE CALLER ALLUDED TO THE JUSTICES...
00:21:53 Guest YEAH. ACTUALLY LIKE TO RESPOND TO BOTH OF THOSE POINTS THERE. ARE SOME 32,000 FISHERMEN THAT ARE...
00:22:43 Host FINISH UP, COLETTE, GO AHEAD AND FIN DISTURB YOUR POINT.
00:22:47 Guest THANK YOU. WITH RESPECT TO THE PROFITS OF EXXON, I THINK, YOU KNOW, IT IS RELEVANT, TO SOME EXTENT,...
00:23:28 Guest TWO QUICK POINTS. FIRST OF ALL, IT IS SIMPLE NOT CORRECT TO DIVIDE THE AWARD TO THE HE -- AS A MEAN...
00:24:55 Host NEXT CALL COMES FROM VIRGINIA. GO AHEAD.
00:24:58 Caller I HAVE KIND OF A COMPLICATED QUESTION FOR BOTH OF YOUR PANELISTS. I HOPE I'M INTELLIGENT ENOUGH TO...
00:26:05 Host THANKS FOR YOUR CALL. MR. HACKER?
00:26:08 Guest WELL, I COMPLETELY AGREE THE COURT IS NOT GOING TO BE SWAYED BY PUBLIC OPINION. BUT, IT IS, OF COURSE,...
00:26:52 Host COLETTE ROUTEL, IT WAS NOT PART OF THE PUBLIC -- ANY KIND OF PUBLIC PRESSURE ON THE JUSTICES, BUT...
00:27:12 Guest I BELIEVE JUSTICE ALITO RECUSED HIMSELF BECAUSE HE OWNS A SUBSTANTIAL AMOUNT OF EXXON STOCKS AND JUST...
00:28:01 Host NEXT UP IS ROSEBURG, OREGON ON OUR LINE FOR DEMOCRATS. GO AHEAD.
00:28:07 Caller GOOD MORNING, FOLKS. THANK GOD FOR C-SPAN. PLEASE DON'T CUT ME OFF HERE. THE QUESTION I NEED TO ASK,...
00:28:45 Host THERE WILL BE NO BUSTING KNEECAPS ON OUR PROGRAM TODAY.
00:28:49 Guest TO ANSWER THE CALLER'S QUESTION, THOUGH, ABOUT I DON'T KNOW WHAT HAS HAPPENED TO ALL THE MEMBERS OF...
00:29:32 Guest I'D ACTUALLY.
00:29:33 Host GO AHEAD.
00:29:34 Guest EXCUSE ME. I'D ACTUALLY LIKE TO TO RESPOND TO THAT, AS WELL. I DO KNOW THAT A NUMBER OF PLAINTIFFS...
00:30:54 Guest JUST TO BE CLEAR, THE DISTRICT COURT, THE SAME DISTRICT COURT WITH UPHELD A $5 BILLION AWARD DISMISSED...
00:31:57 Host THE FOLKS ASKING FOR THIS COMPENSATION IS JUST PRIVATE CITIZENS AND MEN AND WOMEN IN THE FISHING INDUSTRY...
00:32:09 Guest THE STATE HAD AN INTEREST AND LITIGATED IT. IT WAS DAMAGES TO ITS NATURAL RESOURCES AND IT SUED AND...
00:32:47 Host DALLAS, TEXAS, YOU'RE ON THE "WASHINGTON JOURNAL."
00:32:50 Caller GOOD MORNING. THANK YOU FOR C-SPAN. I HAVE MORE OF A COMMENT THAN A QUESTION. SINCE THE "VALDEZ"...
00:33:40 Host WE'LL MOVE ON TO WEST BERLIN, NEW JERSEY ON OUR LINE FOR DEMOCRATS.
00:33:44 Caller YEAH, HOW ARE YOU? I'D LIKE TO SAY, ALSO, JUST A COMMENT THAT IT'S BEEN A LONG TIME AND NOT ONLY DID...
00:34:28 Host COLETTE ROUTEL OUT OF MADISON HEIGHTS, MICHIGAN, GO AHEAD. DID YOU HEAR --
00:34:32 Guest THE COMMENT FROM THAT LAST VIEWER?
00:34:34 Guest YES, SIR -- YES, MA'AM, I'M SORRY.
00:34:37 Guest WELL, I CERTAINLY AGREE THAT EXXON SHOULD GO AHEAD AND PAY THE PUNITIVE DAMAGE AWARD HERE IN THIS...
00:35:08 Host WHY HAS IT TAKEN 19 YEARS FOR THIS CASE TO GET TO THE SUPREME COURT?
00:35:13 Guest WELL, I -- I THINK IT'S COMPLICATED AND ONE OF THE REASONS IT'S TAKEN SO LONG IS THAT EXXON HAS CHANGED...
00:35:48 Guest FLANKLY, THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH IT. THE TRIAL I THINK WAS IN 1994, AN APPEAL ON THE 9th CIRCUIT...
00:36:34 Host THESE ARE PUNITIVE DAMAGES CASES UNRELATED TO
00:36:38 Guest RIGHT, JUST CONSTITUTIONAL CASES AND THAT WAS ONE OF THE ARGUMENTS EXXON HAD BEEN PRESENTING WAS THAT...
00:36:58 Host TALKING ABOUT THE "EXXON VALDEZ" SUPREME COURT CASE ARGUED YESTERDAY WITH JONATHAN HACKER AND COLETTE...
00:37:11 Guest I DID REPRESENT EXXON.
00:37:12 Host YOU DID REPRESENT EXXON. WERE YOU IN THE COURTROOM YESTERDAY?
00:37:14 Guest YES.
00:37:16 Host OKAY. AND HAVE AGREED TO COME ON AND TALK ABOUT THE CASE HERE ON THE "WASHINGTON JOURNAL." NEXT UP...
00:37:26 Caller HELLO. I'M A GREEN. I HAD A FEW COMMENTS TO MAKE. I LIVED IN ALASKA DURING THE TIME OF THE "EXXON...
00:39:16 Host THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR CALL, MA'AM. JONATHAN HACKER?
00:39:20 Guest THERE WAS, IN FACT, A PLAN IN PLACE AGREED UPON -- IT WAS AGREED UPON BY THE PUBLIC OFFICIALS INVOLVED,...
00:40:47 Host AND --
00:40:48 Guest I'D LIKE.
00:40:49 Host GO AHEAD.
00:40:50 Guest IF I MAY RESPOND TO SOME OF THOSE POINTS. I THINK IT'S SORT OF UNFAIR TO CHARACTERIZE THIS AS AN ACCIDENT...
00:43:09 Host WHAT KIND OF QUESTIONS THAT THE JUSTICES HAD THAT WOULD INDICATE THEY ARE GOING TO CONSIDER EITHER...
00:43:25 Guest I DON'T THINK THE LATTER IS IN ISSUE IN THE CASE WHAT THEY COULD HAVE DONE BEFORE THE PIPELINE WAS...
00:44:10 Host LOGANVILLE, GEORGIA, YOU'RE ON THE "WASHINGTON JOURNAL."
00:44:16 Caller THANK YOU, C-SPAN. IT SEEMS TO ME LIKE THE EXXON ATTORNEY AND EXXON ITSELF IS HAIR-SPLITTING OVER...
00:45:25 Host SIR?
00:45:26 Guest WELL, I'VE ALREADY TRIED TO ANSWER THE QUESTION B WHETHER EXXON HAS TAKEN RESPONSIBILITY WHICH IT...
00:46:36 Host MOUNTS SHASTA, CALIFORNIA ON OUR LINE FOR INDEPENDENTS.
00:46:39 Caller GOOD MORNING, C-SPAN.
00:46:40 Host MORNING.
00:46:41 Caller I WANT TO SAY, A COMMENT AND A QUESTION. FIRST OF ALL, I THINK THE TRIAL ITSELF, THE WHOLE ISSUE OF...
00:48:02 Host MR. HACKER?
00:48:03 Guest WELL, THE DOUBLE-HULL ISSUE -- WELL, FIRST OF ON ALL ON THE MEDIA, I DON'T KNOW ANYTHING AT ALL ABOUT...
00:48:50 Host ROCHESTER, NEW YORK ON OUR LINE FOR REPUBLICANS, GO
00:48:53 Caller THANK YOU. HOW ARE YOU TODAY?
00:48:56 Host GO AHEAD WITH YOUR QUESTION, SIR.
00:48:59 Caller I'M CURIOUS, I HAVE A COMMENT AND A SMALL QUESTION. I'M CURIOUS AS TO HOW MR. HACKER FEELS LIKE, WHILE...
00:49:23 Guest NO BONUS. BUT, I DO WANT TO MAKE ONE POINT CLEAR, TO BE -- YOU KNOW, I TRIED TO EXPLAIN THAT EXXON...
00:50:56 Guest I WOULD LIKE TO RESPOND TO THAT POINT AND THAT IS CURRENTLY THERE IS NO LAW THAT SAYS PUNITIVE DAMAGES...
00:51:47 Host OUR LAST CALL FOR THIS SESSION COMES FROM ESSEX, VERMONT ON OUR LINE FOR DEMOCRATS. GO AHEAD.
00:51:53 Caller YES. I THINK WHAT YOU'RE SEEING IS THE CORPORATIZATION OF THE SUPREME COURT. AND IT PLAYS TO EXXON'S...
00:52:42 Guest YEAH. I WOULD SAY THAT I DON'T THINK IT'S NECESSARILY CLEAR THAT THESE NEW APPOINTEES ARE GOING TO...
00:53:32 Guest I AGREE WE ARE GOING TO HAVE TO WAIT AND SEE IT IS UNPREDICTABLE IN SOME WAYS BUT THE FLIP SIDE OF...
00:54:29 Host COLETTE ROUTEL AND JONATHAN HACKER, THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR BEING ON OUR PROGRAM.
00:54:33 Guest THANK YOU.
00:54:35 Host WE ARE GOING TO TAKE A SHORT BREAK THEN WRAP UP THIS EDITION OF "WASHINGTON JOURNAL" WITH OPEN PHONES...

NOTE: The transcript for this program was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.

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